Fisheries Committee on Nov. 25th, 2025

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

No changes either at the Department of Environment.

Let us try to explain that to the citizens listening to us.

How do you explain that failure? Why was the 25% target missed?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

There is just 9.5% missing to the protected areas—

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Okay, but why?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

—but that is too simple an answer.

The departments have invested a lot of time in consultations. I would be more concerned if we did not have exhibits 5 and 6, where we can see that they invested time in protected areas.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Exhibits 5 and 6 show that, even if we add everything up, we still do not reach 25%.

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

If we add everything up, we reach about 9%, and that shows us the gap to be filled.

At the end of exhibit 5, we can see that two of the areas together represent 7.9% of the areas to be protected. A lot of areas will be considered as part of the pipeline process. If they meet the criteria, we will have a good chance of meeting the 2030 target. It is too late to meet the 2025 target, but it is possible to meet the 2030 target.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Talking about pipelines is a strange way to approach that topic, but I understand what you mean.

You expect the 30% protected areas target to be reached by 2030.

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

Yes. If we want to get there, it is possible.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

The reason why the 25% target has not been met is therefore a lack of political will. Is that correct?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

It is not that simple. If there were a lack of will, there would not be a lot of candidate areas in the pipeline construction process.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

There may have been some political will, but it was not enough to achieve the target.

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

Yes, perhaps. There is enough will to speed things up, but if we go too fast, it could have harmful effects on the stakeholder and the purchase price.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Are you talking about a stakeholder?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

Yes, I am talking about a stakeholder. If the process moves too quickly, it could affect them.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

It is a bit upsetting, though. I was a legal aid lawyer representing individuals for 10 years. When they did not meet a target or received too much old age security, they were clawed back quite heavily by the federal government.

However, in this case, we are formally setting a target. Under the Oceans Act, the Minister of Fisheries is responsible for doing that. I understand that there was a bit of political will and that things were done. We cannot say that nothing has been done. However, there was a lack of political will. The minister did not give herself the means to achieve the target when hundreds of millions of dollars had been given to achieve it.

Do you agree with me on that?

[The Chair, Liberal, Patrick Weiler]

I am sorry, but your time is up.

Mr. DeMarco, you can provide an answer in writing or answer in the next round.

That completes our first round.

We're going to move into the second round, starting with Mr. Arnold for five minutes.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, Kamloops—Shuswap—Central Rockies, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I think this is the first time in my 10 years on the committee that the witnesses have outnumbered the MPs. Thank you all for being here.

I'll start with Mr. DeMarco.

I know that your recent report on MPAs is not your first foray into the world of fisheries and oceans. Are you familiar with the Oceans Act and with the Canadian Environmental Protection Act?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

Yes.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, Kamloops—Shuswap—Central Rockies, BC]

The reason I ask is that these two acts, and other federal laws and regulations, like the Fisheries Act, contain provisions that protect and conserve Canada's marine waters, ecosystems and coastal areas. Are you aware of this?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

Yes, I am.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, Kamloops—Shuswap—Central Rockies, BC]

Basically, 100% of Canada's marine waters, ecosystems and coastal areas are already protected by existing federal statutes and regulations. Would you agree with that statement?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

They are not protected in the sense of this report. There are some protections in those pieces of legislation but not to the standard that would qualify as a protected area across the entire waterscape.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, Kamloops—Shuswap—Central Rockies, BC]

There are some protections for 100% of Canada's waters. Is that correct?

[Jerry V. DeMarco]

Yes, there are protections, for example, against depositing deleterious substances or harming fish habitat. Those apply across the board.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, Kamloops—Shuswap—Central Rockies, BC]

These are all protections in place to protect fisheries and the future of Canada's fisheries.