Fisheries Committee on Oct. 21st, 2025

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Beyond the effects on communities, I would like you to give me examples for the members you represent. Has this had a beneficial effect on them?

[Claudio Bernatchez]

Several of our members have received licences, and this has been extremely beneficial for them. It has enabled some to save their fishing businesses, and others to put the bank on hold, which was about to cut them off. So it has been beneficial for several fishing businesses.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Were the catches good?

[Claudio Bernatchez]

Catches have reached an all-time high. The last three years have seen an increase in quantities, and we are very happy for everyone, both those who already had licences and those who have just received them. Will this last? We don’t know, but for the moment, the signs are positive in terms of resources.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Just to clarify, we are talking about zone 19, which is closer to Anticosti Island, in that region, correct?

[Claudio Bernatchez]

Since 2024, three areas have been primarily targeted. The first, in 2024, was zone 18, on the Côte-Nord. This year, in 2025, it was an area off the coast of Anticosti Island, which is zone 17, and along the northern coast of the Gaspésie, which is zone 19.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

During the committee’s most recent meetings, we heard from many herring and mackerel fishers who were unhappy with the decision because they did not receive licences. At previous meetings, I spoke about lobster fishers on the Paspébiac side and along the entire coast, where herring and mackerel fishers are located. Lobster catches are good on that side. As you know, these fishers have also had snow crab allocations since the 2000s.

Do you think that a solution for these herring and mackerel fishers would be to have a small percentage of this allocation, given that lobster fishing is doing considerably better in these regions?

[Claudio Bernatchez]

This is a delicate question to answer. I am not familiar with the dynamics between the Regroupement des pêcheurs professionnels du Sud de la Gaspésie, or RPPSG, and the Regroupement des pêcheurs pélagiques professionnels du Sud de la Gaspésie, or RPPPSG. As I said in my opening remarks, if we can find ways at some point to redistribute aid measures previously granted to others who are doing better to struggling fishers or fleets, fortunately, we may have part of the solution to help avoid certain types of crises.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Perfect. Earlier, you heard some comments about the new allocation, which allocates 10% of the redfish quotas. We agree that 10% is a start, but it is not enough to be profitable, as even government officials have said. What would be the magic number that shrimp fishers would need to make their trips out to sea profitable? Isn’t it cheaper now to go out to sea to fish for redfish rather than shrimp?

[Claudio Bernatchez]

Yes, normally. I’m not saying it will stay that way, but for at least the past two years, when fishers go out to sea to fish for redfish, depending on the time of year and the constraints associated with fishing, they can return to port in less than 24, 36 or 48 hours with a hold that is practically full. Under these conditions, it is already profitable to do so.

On the other hand, I know another fisher who had to “exile” himself to what is known as unit 1 and unit 2 during the winter because unit 1 is not open. In such a case, with the distance to be travelled and the constraints involved, it becomes extremely difficult to make a trip profitable.

[Serge Cormier, Liberal, Acadie—Bathurst, NB]

Okay, perfect.

Mr. Boucher, you said earlier that, in your opinion, the decision to share the new lobster licences was essentially correct. Why do you think some people seem to be saying that there is injustice, a conspiracy, or something else involved in the allocation of these new licences? Do you think the minister’s decision was the right one under the circumstances?

[Jean-René Boucher]

Under the circumstances, it was virtually impossible to make a perfect decision. Taking into account all the factors that had to be analyzed, the realities of the various fleets, the fishers in difficulty and everything else, the decision made was appropriate. It could have been better in some respects, as I mentioned, but overall, adequate work was done on that front.

[The Chair, Liberal, Patrick Weiler]

Thank you very much, Mr. Cormier.

Mr. Deschênes, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Boucher, the fact that fleets are in difficulty is a criterion that often comes up when discussing the allocation of licences. Everyone seems to agree on this criterion. However, how was it determined that some fleets are in greater difficulty than others?

As you so eloquently stated, turbot fishers are facing a collapse in stocks; that is indisputable. Among the members of your group who had licences, were some better off because they had other fishing allocations, such as halibut?

[Jean-René Boucher]

Absolutely. The fact remains that turbot fishing, which has collapsed, was the main source of income for these fishers. It was really the core of their business, to which allowances for other species had been added over time.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

About 16 members of your group had exploratory fishing licences for turbot. What percentage of them also had exploratory fishing licences for halibut?

[Jean-René Boucher]

A groundfish licence gives them access to halibut through the allocation of a competitive quota, now individual quotas. Otherwise, they have access to it through the allocation of individual quotas that have been added over time, as we see with turbot fishing.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

When turbot fishing collapsed, were those in difficulty able to obtain significant quotas for halibut fishing?

[Jean-René Boucher]

They had access to significant quantities of halibut. However, the business was not necessarily profitable, since profitability was based on all species landed, such as turbot, snow crab in some cases, or halibut. By eliminating the largest portion of a company’s revenue, the company may still be able to survive, but it is no longer profitable. The purpose of doing business is not only to be able to make payments, but also to have money left over after making them. That is why companies were affected.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

For example, did some of your fishers catch up to 100,000 pounds of halibut?

[Jean-René Boucher]

No, we are not talking about halibut quotas of that magnitude.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Okay.

You mentioned the consultations you participated in. To your knowledge, was the Department of Fisheries and Oceans interested in the financial situation of each fisher?

[Jean-René Boucher]

This issue was not addressed during these consultations.

The previous witnesses discussed this earlier. From a fisheries management perspective, the financial aspect is not necessarily taken into account. It is part of the suggestions and proposals we presented, knowing, however, that they would probably not be accepted. Although each company has a different financial situation, we were still able to get an overall picture of the situation using the various fisheries and the portfolios of licences held by the fishers involved. Even though we did not know everyone’s financial statements, we still had a good idea of what might happen for everyone.

[Alexis Deschênes, Bloc, Gaspésie—Les Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Listuguj, QC]

Were licences granted to people who managed to pocket hundreds of thousands of pounds, for example by fishing for halibut, despite the collapse of the turbot fishery?

[Jean-René Boucher]

I don’t believe so.