Foreign Affairs Committee on June 6th, 2006

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

Thank you, Mr. Wilfert.

Mr. Goldring, please.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen, for appearing today.

Finland and Canada share a lot of commonalities. We border very large countries and keep our own individual culture while bordering such other large countries. On our borders, we share northern regions and northern industries. We also share other things, for example, in the telecommunications field, with Nokia, the very large telecommunications company, and of course we have our BlackBerry too.

We share another thing too, and that's in sports, in hockey. I believe Jarri Kurri is a well-known Finnish player who played for the Edmonton Oilers. As a matter of fact, he was three doors down from our home in Edmonton, when he was raising his twins. I believe he is back home in Finland now.

We touched a little bit on Kyoto. What we're trying to deal with on Kyoto is to have practical plans that do work and do reduce emissions. One example of that is seeing automobile carriers in my travels to the Caribbean and Japanese vehicles on the streets of various islands. What happens there is that Japan removes vehicles from their streets through emission controls, but what they do with those vehicles is to load them onto ships and sell them throughout the Caribbean. Some of the initiatives that are planned to lower emissions are really negated if you're taking those emissions and shipping them off to another area. I believe there is much to do, internationally, to bring some sensible planning and direction into it.

I'm certainly very comfortable and assured that our country is working on its own to provide the best that we can to work toward clean air and a clean environment.

My question would be more toward one element of your society, and that's the electric power generation. Is it primarily nuclear? Are there issues such as this that you collaborate on with Canadian interests? I believe there is a re-looking in some areas in Canada to renew and refurbish nuclear power in certain provinces, such as New Brunswick, and in Ontario too. Is there much collaboration there? What percentage of the electric power in Finland would be nuclear?

[Liisa Jaakonsaari]

I think it would be beneficial to get the government's point of view. The ambassador will answer that.

[His Excellency Pasi Patokallio, Ambassador, Embassy of Finland (Ottawa)]

In terms of nuclear power, we are actually the European country that's now building new nuclear capacity. There will be a new nuclear power plant on stream in Finland in 2009, which will be our fifth reactor. We are actually looking to nuclear power as part of the energy mix for the future.

As to collaboration in the nuclear field between Canada and Finland, there isn't that much in practical terms, in the terms you were mentioning, on refurbishing. I'm not aware of any particular joint venture we might have in that area.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Have you had other nuclear power facilities? What has your electrical generation primarily been? Has it been hydro and water, or nuclear, or a combination?

[Jari Vilén]

There's actually an ongoing discussion at the moment in Parliament concerning Finland's future energy and environmental policy. I think the discussion is still ongoing; it started this morning, and I think they'll be debating the whole day. A parliamentary report has also been prepared for this kind of policy.

Very briefly, the report outcome is that we will maintain a cocktail of opportunities. Nuclear power will remain one of the most important factors; one-third of the energy that we need comes from nuclear reactors. There's also speculation in Finland that while we're constructing the fifth one with the Finnish-French technology, there will be interest in building a sixth one, because the economy that Finland has is very energy-consuming. A stable price in the economy is therefore extremely crucial. The stable price will now be received through the nuclear energy package. There are then other sources that we have, which are, of course, traditional reactors concerning coal and petroleum.

We're looking for sustainable and renewable energy sources. I think this especially is under debate at the moment. Unfortunately, we don't have any more future plant powers to construct. The legislation is very strict for environmental protection purposes. Those that have been constructed can be maintained and upgraded, but there are no possibilities for new sources.

We're actually looking for other elements that we can have, and bioenergy is one of the elements that we're very actively looking at. It's very time-consuming and very challenging at the moment. It will take a long time before we can change Finnish agriculture, for example, in a manner in which we can have more biofood. The discussion is very hectic at the moment.

It's the same in the European Union. The EU has decided to have a special program at the beginning of the next year during the German presidency, which will be prepared during the Finnish presidency.

I think that one of the key elements, if not the key element, in the discussions with Russia and the EU is energy. Last winter when Russia decided to cut off oil and gas in some of the eastern European countries, it really raised concerns in the European Union. Energy dependence in the EU is increasing all the time. Some countries are 100% dependent on Russian energy, and in some countries it's 50% to 70%. It is a very crucial issue that we have on the agenda at the moment.

[Antero Kekkonen]

I only wanted to say that the new reactor we're building comes from France.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

When you say it was hotly debated in Parliament, on what basis was the debate mainly concentrated? Was it safety concerns? Was it overall public non-acceptance of facilities in their communities or in their neighbourhoods? What's the main criterion or the basis that would denote a hesitancy by members to fully subscribe?

[Jari Vilén]

In Finland, by law, Parliament has to accept the construction of the new nuclear power plant. Parliament has decided on the construction of all the nuclear power plants.

[Liisa Jaakonsaari]

It's not all of them. It's the latest one.

[Jari Vilén]

It's the latest one.

They had to change the legislation. This was voted on and accepted in Parliament. The construction of the fifth one is a unique decision.

Of course, the Green Party especially is talking about safety and security. But the discussion is more about whether it is right to invest. Is nuclear energy seen as a new or an old energy source? The focus of some of the deputations is that Finland should be more focused on renewable energy and bioenergy as future energy sources. Those in my party say that nuclear energy has to be included in the package as one stable source of energy, as long as you're looking for other options.

It was a unanimous opinion by Parliament's economic affairs committee that no source of energy should be excluded from the package that Finland would use. It was basically the decision of the Parliament committee that all energy sources should be open for the Finnish people to take into account development and the challenges we have.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Thank you.

[Maija Perho]

One aspect in the discussion is also the fact that we import nuclear energy from Russia, and they produce it there in very old-fashioned, dangerous reactors. That's why we have been thinking that it's better to build our own.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

Thank you.

I want to basically conclude this committee. I want to thank you for being here. I really hope that you enjoy the rest of your stay here in our country.

I want to thank your ambassador again for being so diligent in seeing whether there was any way that the two committees could get together. Our committees are structured such that we only have certain days that we meet. I'm very glad that he was so diligent, because we made this work, and I think our committee certainly is the better for it.

We appreciated your being here. We've learned a great deal about Finland. Our countries are very close friends and allies and we hope to keep that up. If we can work together in other ways down the road, we look forward to that.

We will conclude this informal meeting.

Thanks for coming.

Madam Lalonde.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

It is not an informal meeting; it's a formal meeting.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kevin Sorenson]

It's a formal meeting. All right.

We had an informal meeting this morning with Tunisia.

The meeting is adjourned.