Foreign Affairs Committee on Oct. 7th, 2010

[Zaynab Elsawi]

As far as I know, no. We don't have that much access to governments, so I was really grateful and thankful for this great chance you provided us with to talk to you. But these kinds of opportunities are not available that much to civil society.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

I'm going to split my time, so I really don't have a whole lot of time. But we do support you. It's very difficult for us--you realize that--to exert pressure on the north. In any way that we can, I know that as a parliamentary committee we would certainly do that, but it's a real challenge. I think you understand that too.

[Zaynab Elsawi]

Thank you.

[Dave Van Kesteren, Conservative, Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON]

I'll split my time with Peter.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Thank you for being here today.

I look at this document here as impressive and certainly totally supportable. I saw a form of this document at an election I was monitoring in Haiti. It was published through the election and it was given to all the parties. I thought it was excellent because it puts forward, certainly, the women's issues through all of the parties, looking for common support. And I really do hope that the initiatives here are followed through.

Along that line, I see in my notes that there was an introduction of Islamic law, Sharia law. Is that a complication to this process, or is it fully integrated into your agenda? Have there been any difficulties or concerns? Has the Sharia law been fully accepted?

[Zaynab Elsawi]

You know, the issue of Sharia has always been the main thing that concerns the national congress. When they stopped talking about it, it was because of certain people from south Sudan. But after the separation, I am sure the issue will be the top issue again. So we will be back to square one whereby the regime wants to apply the Sharia law again, and I think aggressively this time, because all the signs and indicators are saying that. And of course we, as women, are going to be the people who suffer most from that, because, for them, we are actually more than 50% of the population that can be taken by the Sharia law. They will then be finished with all of us simply by issuing the Sharia law.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

I noticed that your agenda here had no mention of the Sharia law, in the agenda itself.

Another point on the referendum: I do hope it's a very clear question and the margin of acceptance for it is at 50% plus one. They say in a referendum for separation that that can be hugely problematic, if you do not have a large percentage of people willing to move in a certain direction. Even in the referendum act that we have--the Clarity Act, we call it--it actually raises that bar of acceptance. It mentions in it 13 times that it must be a majority of the people, not a majority of the voters. So that virtually means that if 80% of the people vote, 20% is a de facto no vote.

Do you have that type of thing written into your...? Has it been designed yet, or...?

[Zaynab Elsawi]

Yes, I think that the referendum will get a lot of attention and concern. Actually, the government of south Sudan is making a lot of effort to make people who are going to vote fully aware of the processes for them. They did that.

I've been to Juba twice in the last six months. Whenever I go, I realize that separation is happening. The last time I was there I spoke to so many people. Nobody supported unity, no one, not even my close friends. It was like, okay, what about us? They simply said, “Well, we'll be good neighbours”. That is very sad for me.

They also said that women in Sudan will remain women of Sudan, even after separation. “We still have a lot to do together, but we wish you all the best with your problem facing the regime and fighting for your rights. We cannot afford to fight for you.”

Thank you.

[Peter Goldring, Conservative, Edmonton East, AB]

Well, good luck. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you, Mr. Goldring.

We're going to finish up with Mr. Pearson, and then we have a little bit of committee business to take care of. I think we're all in agreement, so we'll finish with Mr. Pearson.

[Glen Pearson, Liberal, London North Centre, ON]

Ms. Elsawi, I just have a couple of comments before I give you the last word. I think you're remarkably eloquent, and you're brave for coming. I thank you for doing that, because I think as a woman between north and south Sudan, you have the greatest challenge. Our thoughts are with you. I also want to thank Inter Pares for bringing you over. I think that's very important for us to hear.

I want to get to what's already been said and what I asked earlier. All the attention has been about the south. That's just the way it's been for years. You face very unique challenges that southern women don't. We need to know, as a committee, how we can help you. Would it be, as was happening during the war, that you bring women's groups out to Nairobi so that it's easier? Can we fund conferences and things like that where women from the north and the south can come and continue to dialogue? I greatly fear exactly what you've said: the communication that was necessary to bring the war to an end will not stay in place after separation takes place. I think you need the help of the Government of Canada and many others to allow the structure to take place so that communication continues to happen and women's groups keep coming together.

Can you give me some practical suggestions about parliamentarians going over and doing those things or maybe bringing some people here? Do you have other suggestions? How can we help so that this stays together?

[Zaynab Elsawi]

Thank you very much for mentioning that.

Regarding the communication between women, it's very important to bring women together. So far, we are doing that with difficulty. Before signing the CPA, we did that outside Sudan with the support of the Netherlands embassy regarding the Sudanese Women Empowerment for Peace. They met in Nairobi several times. They met in Addis Ababa. They met in Asmara. They met in Cairo. They met in The Hague, because it was difficult for the southerners to come to Khartoum to meet with women from the north. The first joint meeting after signing the CPA was conducted in 2007. That was the first time they met in Khartoum.

I don't know how the situation is going to be after the referendum. We might need to meet outside, as it used to be in the past. We would really appreciate the support of the Canadian government to facilitate that. That would be good support, and we would really appreciate that.

The other thing is to allocate funds for civil society organizations, especially for women's groups, and to consider their capacity. I think that also is going to be a great help. To keep on having meetings like that is also something. Yes, I'm here working on behalf of civil society, but I'm sure that there are so many great women who might do a better job than what I'm doing, much better, if they got the chance, like my colleague, who couldn't get a visa to attend this meeting with me, and she left me all alone. There are so many great women in Sudan. If we can just get the chance to make our voices heard, just to let you know what we've been through, that would also be something. Maybe there could be a forum between the Canadian government and the civil society every other year to address the issues, the needs, and the priorities. This would be a great help, and we would really appreciate it.

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Thank you very much for being here today. I also echo the sentiments of our committee members when I tell you we appreciate you taking the time.

I'll suspend the meeting for one minute, enough time to hand out three motions before we go in camera.

Thank you very much.

[Proceedings continue in camera]