Foreign Affairs Committee on Feb. 7th, 2013

[Bart Witteveen]

Yes. Unfortunately I can't give you an easy answer to that. We've been engaged in conventional development assistance, as Elly mentioned in her introduction, for almost 30 years in Mali. A lot of this is being undermined by this escalating conflict. We're really facing a complicated challenge in terms of trying to address the immediate needs and at the same time build on the development work that we've been engaged in for so long.

As some have already mentioned, all of this is taking place against the backdrop of recurring drought and a severe food-insecure environment. We try as best we can under the circumstances to continue our development engagement, which is a range of interventions brought together in terms of trying to strengthen the resilience of the most vulnerable in Mali and at the same time trying to address these new needs that are coming up on top.

The simple answer is we continue those developmental activities as best we can but recognizing that the priority at this point is the humanitarian response.

[Kevin McCort]

If I may, I can give you some specific examples of the kinds of programs.

We have, as an example, a $1.6-million contribution from CIDA through partners with Canadians branch, and one of the things it is doing very specifically is trying to improve the access of women to agricultural-related investments. It's based on evidence that if you can narrow the gap between men's access to agricultural production and women's, in many places you can double the amount of food that is produced.

So we are working to ensure that women have equitable and equal access to seeds, agricultural credit, land, and agricultural extension services so that they can improve their production. Women are usually very much involved in household-level food production. So we're very specifically focusing on improving women's access to the means of production around household food security. That's a very specific example of what agencies like ours are doing with funds that we receive from CIDA directly or through the Sahel fund that you mentioned.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

Okay, thank you. That's all the time we have.

We're going to move over to Mr. Eyking, sir, for seven minutes.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you for coming today. Most of our study so far has been on the military action and I think it's good that we're switching channels because you are on the ground and dealing with what's now and what's in the future.

I was in Mali five years ago and even though it's a poor country—I visited the farms and some of the communities—there was a transition and optimism going there. It's a shame that it's into a bit of a civil war, and civil wars bring out the darkness of human beings. As somebody mentioned, there are over 4 million people in need there right now. I think some of the recommendations that have come out so far are, of course, that there has to be more aid money and that we should have a CIDA presence in Mali.

Also, I think the whole UN was alluded to. The UN is going to have a key role here and their present government should have a better relationship with them as we go forward.

I have a couple of questions first for World Vision, and then I'm going to go over to you, Mark.

I think, Elly, you mentioned this $1 million the government provided to help work with World Vision. Can you just give me a quick description? Is that for Mali or is that for Africa? Or what's that $1 million for?

[Bart Witteveen]

That $1 million was allocated in this last round of funding. It's part of the $13 million that's been previously mentioned and that's meant to provide immediate humanitarian response to the current context, in particular related to food insecurity, the provision of cash and food, as well as water and sanitation projects.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

It's part of that $13 million, and you would use that $1 million to buy food and get it on the ground.

[Bart Witteveen]

Among other things....

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

The other part is you mentioned this civil-military oversight. Give me a little description of what you would like to see there and how we could be part of that.

[Bart Witteveen]

The crucial issue is that the humanitarian actors need to be able to operate independently of the military action, that it should not be expected to take place in support, that it should not be hindered, and that we can develop our response purely on the basis of need. Similarly, we are advocating that the civilian population have the freedom to move in response to the evolution of the conflict for their own protection and their own safety. It's as simple and basic as that. What we're asking for is any effort, any voice that can impress upon, in particular, the military actors, but also in terms of the UN and their leadership within humanitarian coordination to ensure that this can take place.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Of course, the ambassadors were here and everybody is very optimistic that this is going to settle down fairly soon and everybody is going to get back to some sort of normality, but the reality is that after civil wars, there are scars and deep wounds and there are still animosities. I think, Mark, you mentioned how this is going to spread. Were you alluding to refugees on the move? What did you mean by the spread to other countries and to other parts of Africa?

[Mark Fried]

I'm referring to how the conflict itself has an impact on neighbouring countries. The most direct, obvious impact is when people cross the border and have to be taken care of. We have hundreds of thousands of people who had to flee their homes, who are now living in neighbouring countries. If they have some people to stay with, they're staying with people who are equally as poor as them or they're staying in camps. Oxfam and other agencies are providing them with basic survival services, but it's a burden. Until they can return safely home once the conflict is over, it's going to be a long-term burden for those neighbouring countries that are very poor to begin with.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Are those camps set up by the neighbouring countries? Are we involved in monitoring those camps and getting aid to those camps?

[Mark Fried]

Well, Oxfam certainly is providing assistance there. I believe I met colleagues with CARE—

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

NGOs are, but is there a government involved with these other countries in helping deal with this?

[Mark Fried]

I believe the Canadian government provides support via the United Nations agencies.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

The other part is, my interest is a lot with food—because I'm a farmer—and in food aid, and I've seen the farmers there. I don't think Mali was really self-sufficient in food, but there was a lot of trade going on. You alluded to that whole disruption. Let's assume that in our best-case scenario things settle down. How can we, as our government, help the NGOs bring that back to where it needs to be so we don't get to where we're just bringing food and dropping food off? How can we get that whole economy going back to trade and food coming back and forth to other countries? How can we do that to install that quicker than just dropping off food to keep them going?

[Mark Fried]

Once the conflict is over, when people are no longer killing each other, there will be a phase of reconstruction, of rehabilitation.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

But they would have left their farms and left their land.

[Mark Fried]

Most people actually are pastoralists; they herd goats or other animals. So it's not exactly a farm, and many of them are nomadic. They will have lost many of their assets, which are their animals, because they don't have anywhere to sell them now and there is a shortage, of course, of pasture, as there always is. So, you have to keep selling your goats in the market and the markets are disrupted. There likely will have to be a period where we'll be restocking—

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Micro-financing could be helpful for them to get back into the game.

[Mark Fried]

That may have a role. We've provided animals to people, veterinary services. That's something that Oxfam does regularly when people are recovering from a drought or a conflict. Once they've recovered, it's important to make sure that the markets are actually functioning, that is, keeping borders open so that food can be traded across borders, making sure that there are traders who can actually operate. That's where the micro-finance may come in for those who may want to become traders, since the traders have fled, those who buy the goats and then resell them as meat. People have to actually perform that function, which is now almost entirely disrupted in Gao.

[Mark Eyking, Liberal, Sydney—Victoria, NS]

Our government could play a big role in helping that happen. We have to get on the ground and help you people.

[Mark Fried]

I would hope so, thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Dean Allison]

We have less than 10 minutes left, and I know we're going to start the next round in five minutes. What I'm going to do, Mr. Williamson, is give you about three minutes, and I'll give the NDP one final question just to wrap up with the witnesses today.

Mr. Williamson, the floor is yours.

[John Williamson, Conservative, New Brunswick Southwest, NB]

Thank you. It's been very interesting. It's obvious that the need in Mali is great and resources are being deployed, but not enough. It's hoped that more will come.

I want to flip back to something that was brought up that deals with security. We're in a situation now where we have both a military as well as a humanitarian crisis as a result of border security that wasn't adequate, and even domestic institutions in Mali weren't adequate for the task at hand.

Putting that aside—I don't want to look back at the past; the past is the past and we can move forward—I am curious to know how your work will be affected should the French pull out. What are your concerns on the ground for the protection of your people and people who deliver aid? Is there a concern that, if the French pull out, domestic and African soldiers will be able to secure the peace? I'd like quick answers from all of you because I think it's important that we don't revert to a situation that is again traumatic on the ground, or continues to be traumatic or lawless.