Evidence of meeting #114 for Foreign Affairs and International Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was terrorism.
A recording is available from Parliament.
5:15 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
I cannot comment on that, but as I mentioned, the money exchanges in Toronto have means to directly exchange money with Iran, and that can easily be exploited by the IRGC and any Iranian government members.
5:15 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
To combat this organization in Canada—and, it seems, across the world, but we need to worry about Canada the most—do you think we are serious about doing this, and do we understand totally how big and how serious our enemy is in order to be able to find the proper resources to fight it?
5:15 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
I cannot comment on that.
5:15 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
You do understand the mindset of the IRGC, since you were born in Iran, and that's probably beginning to understand how big the challenge is.
5:15 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
Of course the IRGC, by design, is an international organization. They export their revolution, and that still persists, that ideology of exporting their revolution, expanding the rule of velayat-e faqih throughout the world.
The creation of this Islamic civilization, the ideal Islamic civilization, by the supreme leader, Ayatollah Khamenei, is not just a theory; the IRGC has been assigned by the supreme leader—and that's official—to implement his ideas and his doctrine.
The IRGC has been trying to establish influence in Canada is because of the large Iranian-Canadian community—
5:15 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
Do you think they are deep-rooted within the community itself, the communities they can speak to, or even beyond those communities? They might have branched out with that fundamental challenge to Canada's security and economy, and to other situations.
5:15 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
First and foremost, the focus of the IRGC in Canada is on the Iranian-Canadian community, and also the dissidents—the Iranian dissidents who live in Canada—and also any organization or NGO that has any kind of focus on the plight of the Iranian people.
5:15 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
But they are also a threat to the overall Canadian society, beyond the community, aren't they?
5:15 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
Yes, because the Iranian-Canadian community is an integral part of the Canadian system.
5:15 p.m.
Conservative
Ziad Aboultaif Conservative Edmonton Manning, AB
What are the consequences of fighting them, versus just staying quiet on dealing with them?
5:15 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
As I mentioned, the IRGC is an adaptive, complex system. They adapt to new conditions and situations, and they have shown the ability to increase their role, to increase their presence. That has been the case in Canada and in many other countries that have an Iranian diaspora.
5:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
Thank you very much.
I'll take the next segment. I would like to start off with Mr. Aarabi.
First of all, I should say, the interpreters are advising that your volume is very high. Could you kindly turn it down a bit before you respond to this question?
You touched on an incident in the U.K., a terrorist attack that was orchestrated by the IRGC. Given that most members here aren't familiar with it, could you give us more examples, whether in the U.K. or more broadly throughout Europe? That's the first question.
The second one is this: Could you perhaps advise us as to why the British government never chose to proscribe the IRGC?
5:20 p.m.
Director of IRGC Research, United Against Nuclear Iran
The two main targets by IRGC terrorism across the world are the Iranian diaspora community and the Jewish community. The IRGC is the most anti-Semitic organization in the world. A big part of its focus is targeting the Jewish community abroad.
In the U.K., the IRGC has carried out surveillance, identifying Jewish targets. It has created a hit list for Jewish community members.
Similarly, in Germany, they have done the same. They have also targeted Jewish synagogues and Jewish kindergartens, as well as Iranian diaspora members.
They have been pushing and trying to mainstream anti-Semitism across Europe, across North America, as well as directly conducting these terror plots and terror attacks. The majority, fortunately, have been foiled by British security authorities.
They have also, as I have said, been nurturing homegrown radicalization. I think this really goes to the point. The current sanctions regime on the IRGC does not prohibit its radicalization activities. It's using the same methods as ISIS and al Qaeda, but unlike ISIS and al Qaeda, which are proscribed terrorist organizations, the current sanctions regime does not prohibit the IRGC's ability to nurture homegrown radicalization, and it is specifically targeting not the Iranian diaspora community—because the overwhelming majority of Iranians who live abroad oppose the Islamic Republic and oppose the IRGC—but the Shia community abroad. That's a sizable community.
5:20 p.m.
Director of IRGC Research, United Against Nuclear Iran
They are targeting, for example, in Britain, the British Shia Iraqis, the British Shia Lebanese, the British Shia Afghanis, and British Shia Pakistanis—
5:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
I'm so sorry. I have limited time.
Could you also kindly explain to us why the British government has yet to proscribe the IRGC?
5:20 p.m.
Director of IRGC Research, United Against Nuclear Iran
I think it's an abject failure in British policy. I think that the opposition has already pledged, as a priority, that it will prescribe the IRGC as a terrorist organization.
In Britain, there was a visible disagreement between the Home Office and the Foreign Office. The Home Office was in favour of proscribing the IRGC, and rightly so, because first and foremost, the proscription of the IRGC is an interior ministry issue. It is about British national security and the protection of British citizens. Unfortunately, the Foreign Office opposed the move and was able to block it.
However, there is hope with the opposition party, which is predicted to win the election. Of course, we can't predict elections, but the polling shows that. The opposition party has pledged that it will proscribe the IRGC as an immediate foreign policy priority and domestic security issue.
5:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
Thank you very much for that.
If I could go to Dr. Nadimi next, Mr. Aarabi explained some of the practical consequences that would follow if the IRGC were to be proscribed in Canada. Could you elaborate on that as well? In your opinion, what would be the consequences?
5:20 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
The IRGC has a naval branch, the IRGC Navy, which operates small missile boats, a large number of them, and has also recently commissioned missile corvettes. It has control of the Persian Gulf, the Strait of Hormuz and the shipping lanes to and from that strategic water lane.
One possible repercussion could be the targeting of Canadian-flag or Canadian-affiliated ships that use the Persian Gulf, the Strait of Hormuz and the Gulf of Oman, by measures such as seizures and other intrusive activities. Even more serious actions could be considered.
5:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
Thank you very much for that.
We will now go to MP Bergeron. You have two and a half minutes, sir.
5:20 p.m.
Bloc
Stéphane Bergeron Bloc Montarville, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
In an article on rising tensions in the Middle East published by the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, you said that it was essential to note that the Iranian regime's actions did not reflect the wishes of the Iranian population as a whole, most of whom were seeking peaceful coexistence with other countries in the region.
My question is quite simple. To what extent does the regime's propaganda towards, say, the state of Israel resonate with the Iranian population?
From the contacts you still have in the country, how has the Iranian population reacted to Iran's attack on Israel?
5:25 p.m.
Senior Fellow, The Washington Institute for Near East Policy, As an Individual
The Iranian regime does have some support base. There are differences in the percentage, with some people counting a support base of as much as 9% to 10% of the Iranian people.
In general, I can sum up the reaction of the Iranian people, especially those who oppose the regime, as indifference. However, those who do support the regime are in a very celebratory mood, because after over 40 years of self-declared war against Israel, finally the regime had a chance to launch missiles, drones and cruise missiles from Iranian territory against Israel proper. That was considered a major achievement, given that ultimately the Israeli response was very measured. Those who supported the regime were very happy about it, and obviously the majority of Iranian people who did not support the regime were indifferent—or, in many cases, they went on social media to offer support to the Israelis.
5:25 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
Thank you.
We next go to MP McPherson. You have two and a half minutes.
5:25 p.m.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I'm interested in knowing about the impact that your research has had on both of you. Could you tell me whether researchers like you feel that you're at risk because of your work, in the same way that we have seen other critics of the IRGC put at risk?
Perhaps I would start with you, Dr. Nadimi.