Mr. Chair, I'm in that moment where I'm agreeing with everything that Mr. Bergeron says, so I'm trying to sit on the edge of my seat to hear what he says next.
I didn't raise a point of order, but had a concern for two reasons. One, we weren't on the topic of the motion. There's also what I would call “scope creep”—I don't know how we would translate that—about this motion.
I think this motion is about a decision the government made with respect to a permit to allow turbines to be sent, after refurbishing, to Germany. That is our topic. We have had an opposition day already on the topics that Mr. Chong is raising. The House has spoken on it. I would leave that for a later study. I would like us to be fairly focused on this set of meetings with respect to this critical decision the government made. I think the committee has the right to give advice to the government on it and to opine on it.
I have some concerns about the subamendment. The first would be with respect to the Deputy Prime Minister. There's no more effective and better spokesperson for Canada with respect to Ukraine than our Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Finance. There's no doubt about that. However, this was not her decision. The decision that was made...the permit is signed by the Minister of Foreign Affairs, and the negotiation was done under the responsibility of the Minister of Natural Resources.
While it's always wonderful to listen to Minister Freeland, I don't think that's relevant to the question at stake here. Again, I think the opposition would be unwise to unleash her to speak on this issue. I think she's passionate and informed and a world expert on it; however, I don't think her contribution on this particular issue is appropriate or timely. I think we want the other two ministers.
Also, I think it would slow down the process. Trying to find one minister's availability is always tough. Two is tougher and three is worse. I would suggest that is not appropriate.
I think we rarely would ever call a foreign minister from another country. We have an ambassador, and that's what an ambassador's job is. I would keep it to the ambassador of Ukraine to Canada as the most appropriate spokesperson for Ukraine at this forum. So, I would not agree with that.
I have a concern. I have great respect for the Ukrainian World Congress, but Mr. Chong raises the issue of their going before a court. As soon as we get into an issue that is before a court, as with one of the protagonists in that court action, it changes the nature of what ministers are able to contribute at this committee. I think we're on very thin ice, because that opens the door to ministers simply not being able to comment because it is sub judice, before the courts. I think it's not wise for us to invite someone who has brought an action to the Federal Court on this. I think that would actually thwart the committee's ability to hear from the ministers the way I think we want to hear from them.
I would say that's unwise, so I would not be voting for this subamendment for those reasons. I think the Deputy Prime Minister is not the appropriate person on this issue. It's the two ministers named, and they're easier to get than getting three. They signed the permit and they gave the advice to the government on the issue. It is not appropriate to bring the Deputy Prime Minister, nor the foreign minister from Ukraine. We have the ambassador listed. That is the spokesperson for that country in this country.
While I have great respect for Marcus Kolga, and I don't know the other two people the member mentioned, I would say again I would hold this until we get to the fourth item, and look at other witnesses once we have the key witnesses done, to find out what to do. Marcus Kolga does some great work on Russian disinformation. I don't know of him as an expert on natural gas and the topics that Mr. Chong has raised.
I would like us to do some thinking about future witnesses, but hear from the key witnesses we've named and added to the list, and try to contain the study and not get into a study about pipelines going across Canada or LNG capacity in Canada to feed Europe. We had a whole day on that with an opposition motion in the House. I think that was fine. We can look later at Europe's need to change its dependency on energy sources from Russia. They're well aware of it; believe me. I don't think it is necessarily our job to preach to other countries about something they're already well aware of, which is being held hostage by Russia on energy. We also know it takes time for them to do that. I would speak against that subamendment.
There may be other possibilities to change it, but I think right now all we need to do is add the ambassadors from Germany and the EU, and then a later amendment could look at additional witnesses as required.