Foreign Affairs Committee on Feb. 17th, 2022

[Marty Morantz, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia—Headingley, MB]

Mr. Genuis is going to take my round. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sven Spengemann]

Mr. Genuis, the floor is yours.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Mr. Morantz.

I want to follow up on this issue of accountability for human rights abuses. I would like to hear a little bit more concretely about what steps the Canadian government is taking to hold those individuals who are responsible for human rights abuses accountable for their actions.

[Tarik Khan]

Thank you for the question.

The first thing I would say is that it is really critical for us to corroborate and have adequate evidence regarding individual actions and individual violations perpetrated by individuals. For that, we rely on independent investigations such as the OHCHR and EHRC work.

We co-sponsored two resolutions on the situation in Tigray at the Human Rights Council, and we later supported the EU's call for a special human rights council session in December.

With the U.S., we have also co-led demarches of Eritrea and Ethiopian authorities on conflict-related sexual violence, both in Ethiopia as well as in the capitals of Sudan and Eritrea.

Our view is that as soon as we have adequate evidence of violations by individuals, we take an assessment, and we look at the extent to which we can respond to those individual instances or whether it makes more sense for us to invest in some of the collective responses that are going to take place in those countries. For example, we are also calling upon Ethiopia itself to investigate human rights abuses and to take responsibility as a government, as a state party to the conflict, for those abuses.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Do you think it's realistic that Ethiopia itself will hold accountable those who were responsible for human rights abuses?

[Tarik Khan]

That's an excellent question. I think time will tell. Obviously, we have concerns about whether Ethiopia will live up to that expectation of the international community, something that we're all calling for, but time will tell. I think the next few months will be critical in terms of both resolution as well as accountability.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Thank you.

Based on the evidence you have right now, are you willing to legally define any of the crimes that have taken place? I note you haven't called it a genocide in response to questioning from my colleague. Would you use terminology like “crimes against humanity”, for example? Can we say based on the evidence that we have, in your view, that certain definable international crimes have been committed?

[Tarik Khan]

From the reporting that we have read from the OHCHR HRC report, it is clear that atrocity crimes may have taken place—and atrocity crimes include war crimes and crimes against humanity.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Sorry to interrupt, but I do note that there's a bit of an equivocation there, because the words you used were “it is clear that atrocity crimes may have taken place”. Would you say it is clear that atrocity crimes have been committed, or atrocity crimes may have been committed in the government's view?

[Tarik Khan]

Our view is they may have been committed. There are, of course, allegations of those crimes, but we need to see confirmation and adequate investigation beyond the—

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Sorry, I want to be clear about the government's position. It sounds like you're not prepared to say that atrocity crimes have definitely been committed—at least at this stage.

[Tarik Khan]

We would look to a competent international court to make that determination.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Under these various international human rights treaties, Canada has responsibilities as a party. We can't defer to international bodies fully, because we are committed to upholding certain human rights obligations as a signatory to those agreements, and we have powers ourselves through sanctions and other means to hold individuals accountable for those actions. Absent some international determination, would Canada be prepared to come to its own conclusions and act on those conclusions with respect to atrocity crimes?

[Tarik Khan]

For something as serious as atrocity crimes, it is really critical for us to have an independent and competent body investigating and making that determination for us.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Do we not have the capacity to have competent bodies that are able to proceed in the absence of coordinated international action, though? This seems to me to be a fundamental legal problem around human rights, which is that we are party to agreements that oblige us to take certain action in response to certain events, yet we always try to defer and say that we're only responsible if somebody else determines that a crime has been committed. Irwin Cotler has told the Subcommittee on International Human Rights very eloquently in past cases that the fact that we are a state party to these agreements means that we have obligations, regardless of what external international bodies do or do not determine, or are or are not able to determine. Would you agree with that?

[Tarik Khan]

I think the key is that the investigative work that takes place to make that determination requires access. For us to independently make that investigation, we would need access to both victims and evidence, and in that case, it's usually international bodies such as the UN that can get that kind of access to—

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

Then it just becomes too easy for states to shut this out.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sven Spengemann]

I'm sorry, but we'll have to leave it there. It's very likely that you'll have an occasion to follow up in the next round, so we'll leave it there and put a bracket around that until you have a chance to speak again.

Ms. Bendayan, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank the witnesses for their insightful comments.

Mr. Khan, I have several questions for you. You spoke about the significant humanitarian aid that Canada has provided to Ethiopia since the start of the conflict. I want to speak briefly about our announcement on June 18, 2021. Canada has provided an additional $7 million in humanitarian aid. Could you tell us where that money was allocated?

Based on your responses, I gather that some of the funding has been for food security, health care and victims of sexual violence.

Can you provide information on the $7 million?

[Tarik Khan]

Thank you.

My colleague, Mr. Salewicz, can answer your question.

[Stephen Salewicz]

Indeed, those resources were directed to our partners that were active in the conflict zone. Part of those resources went to the Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs, which manages a pooled fund. They use these resources for a series of projects they deliver in this context.

I would point to some of the types of projects they were able to deliver. They provided a series of projects that responded to nutrition requirements in Amhara and Afar, as well as in Tigray. These are critical projects to respond to the food insecurity that we're all well aware of.

Speaking of food insecurity, indeed the WFP has indicated that over the course of the last year and a half during the conflict, we've seen the food insecurity numbers jump from 0.4 million members of the population to over 4.6 million people in need. Indeed, the food situation is dire, and the resources that were provided were specifically to help respond to those food needs.

I've mentioned WFP in addition as a key partner in the international response, and our support contributed to WFP's response. There have been convoys that have been able to get through. They've been very modest, and I think we all agree that not enough has been done on this front.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

I hate to interrupt you, Mr. Salewicz. I do have a few more questions.

[Stephen Salewicz]

Sure, please do.

[Rachel Bendayan, Liberal, Outremont, QC]

Other than food security, can you list the other things? Perhaps you would prefer to respond in writing with a complete list.

[Stephen Salewicz]

Sure, we can do that. I'd say that we provided funding to WFP, to ICRC, to OHCHR, which manages a common fund of country-based pooled funds that financed 116 projects last year alone. We contribute to these activities. They're widespread.

We'll give you a written response.