Evidence of meeting #73 for Foreign Affairs and International Development in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was individuals.
A video is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Sameer Zuberi Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
Thank you for being here today, Dr. Juneau. I found your testimony so interesting.
I've read about you over the years and I'm happy to see you in front of the committee now. I want to give you about a minute or so if you want to add anything that you haven't said thus far, anything that you think is new and would help us in our report.
Associate Professor, Public and International Affairs, University of Ottawa, As an Individual
Anything new....
Liberal
Sameer Zuberi Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
Yes, is there anything different that you want to add? You don't have to. If you don't have anything, that's fine.
I want to ask about unintended consequences. We focus a lot on Iran and how we want to engender positive behaviour from all states, including Iran and the leadership there. That's why we've applied important sanctions in different ways, and we want to get a positive result. You spoke about unintended consequences, which I think is really interesting. It takes us away from talking points, catchy headlines, clickbait and slogans, which we so often gravitate towards but can't get away from.
We have no form of diplomatic relations with Iran. At one point in time there were some. There was a point in time when Canadians were asking for some level, some type of conversation, or a diplomatic mission, a diplomatic presence. Without taking away from the crimes the Iranian government is committing against its own people, do you want to add anything on this point at all?
Associate Professor, Public and International Affairs, University of Ottawa, As an Individual
Over the years, I've been on the record a lot as supporting the idea of reopening embassies in Iran and having Iran reopen its embassy here. I'm firmly of the view that you have to talk to the bad guys. I've written about that a lot.
I haven't changed my view, in theory. The difference is that now, as of 2023, it is simply not going to happen in practice. There was an opening after 2015. The government tried. It didn't succeed, for reasons we could get into in a separate conversation. Basically, that ship has sailed. It is not going to happen for the foreseeable future.
Liberal
Sameer Zuberi Liberal Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC
I asked that question in the interest of getting to what is best and helpful for the people of Iran and all those fighting for freedom, justice and equity.
I'll cede my time to the committee.
Liberal
Bloc
Stéphane Bergeron Bloc Montarville, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Last June, the Government of Canada amended 14 sets of regulations under the United Nations Act to provide an exemption for humanitarian assistance in accordance with UN Security Council resolutions 2615 and 2664. The International Committee of the Red Cross has called on the Government of Canada to standardize humanitarian exemptions in all of its sanctions regimes.
For the benefit of the members of our committee, can you tell us what the standardization of exemptions would be in all the sanctions regimes?
Legal Advisor, International Committee of the Red Cross
Thank you for raising UN Security Council Resolution 2664, which we see as a very important step globally. As you mentioned, it adopts a standardized humanitarian carve-out across all UN sanctions regimes, and it was also subsequently implemented in the United Nations Act in Canada.
We see this as a very important measure to emphasize the importance of standardized humanitarian carve-outs. It provides the clarity needed for humanitarian organizations and private sector actors, as we mentioned previously as well, to carry out and facilitate our work in those places where there might be sanctions in place. We see Resolution 2664 as an important model that can influence countries as they're looking to incorporate humanitarian carve-outs in their domestic autonomous sanctions as well.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
For the final question, we go to MP McPherson.
You have a minute and a half.
NDP
Heather McPherson NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB
I want to dive a bit more into this humanitarian carve-out piece. I recognize the need for standardized humanitarian carve-outs, which we just heard about. Obviously, that's not the case in Canada right now, with Bill C-41.
To my understanding, no money has actually gone to Afghanistan to date, even though that carve-out has already been put into place, because it is so onerous and difficult to navigate.
I'd like to know what the Red Cross's experience has been with the process so far and what Canada should have done differently. Knowing that there is a one-year review that was put into that legislation, what are the lessons that the government needs to learn to fix this legislation going forward?
Senior Legal Advisor, International Humanitarian Law, Canadian Red Cross
I can connect some of the dots there. One, I can confirm that the Canadian Red Cross has been asked to participate in the government process in order to develop the legislative guidance—that's not the technical term, but it's the instruction to civil society. Because of the confidential nature of that engagement, I can't speak to anything further beyond that, to the specifics, but we also look forward to the clarity that hopefully will flow from that.
One of the recommendations we have for the committee, coming from this, is for consistency among the various pieces of legislation. We have the sanctions. We have SEMA, the UN Act, the Criminal Code provisions. We also have all the laws on charities. We're asking the committee for that consistency in the exemptions. That way, there is clarity and consistency so we can speak to each other clearly, and there are clear indications to civil society that it can be subject to the exemption. That way, civil society is able to operate with confidence, which it struggles with at the moment.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ali Ehsassi
That concludes the questions from the members.
At this juncture, I'd like to thank all of our witnesses for their time and their invaluable expertise. We're very grateful you could appear before us.
Before I adjourn, I want to remind everyone that next week we will continue with the study on sanctions. For committee business, we're going to have 45 minutes as opposed to an hour, as it just came to my attention that four witnesses will be appearing. For the first hour and 15 minutes, we'll hear from those witnesses, and then we'll go to committee business.
If everyone agrees, this meeting stands adjourned.