Government Operations Committee on Oct. 17th, 2006

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

So you're saying that in a city like Toronto, where we still have a problem with many marginalized youth, and it's been very high profile when we've had difficulties with marginalized youth, these programs will still be there for them?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

The component for youth at risk is one we're not touching. We'll respond in many ways. I know I have met with Frances Lankin, the head of the United Way of Greater Toronto, to talk about what we can do to better coordinate and work with officials in Toronto. But the component for youth at risk is an important one, and one that we specifically exempted.

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Can you explain why the word “equality” has disappeared form the Status of Women website?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

I haven't been on the Status of Women website. I think you could direct that to the minister. I think we all support equality.

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

The word has changed to “participation” as opposed to “equality”, and the real concern is that with 40% of the Status of Women budget being chopped, women's organizations across the country will suffer from this, women's voices will be silenced. And there's real concern that your government does not share a commitment to women's equality.

So I ask you, does your government share a commitment to women's equality?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Yes.

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

Then why are you cutting the Status of Women budget by 40%?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

I think if you look at a department with a budget in the order of $20-odd million, the amount spent on administration versus the support to communities was so incredibly high--I think it was the highest of any department that was in the government--and to have such a small department with such a huge regional presence.... With the increases we're giving for a cancer control strategy or for health care, how many women who are on the waiting list for breast cancer surgery, for cervical cancer surgery, for hip and knee replacements.... Their ability to participate in society is being impinged on because we didn't have enough resources for health care. We made a choice to say that rather than having more administration in that department we would put more money into the front-line system for our hospitals, for our doctors, for our nurses, for our long-term-care beds.

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

For the oil and gas industry.

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

I don't think there are any changes in our budget with respect to the oil and gas industries.

[Peggy Nash, NDP, Parkdale—High Park, ON]

You're right, the subsidies continue. I think pitting women with cancer against women who are advocating against violence against women is a false dichotomy.

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

I always found it very interesting that the Status of Women would provide money for advocacy but not money for front-line services. I know I found that very frustrating. When I was in Ontario we opened a good number of shelters around the province; we opened two new shelters for battered women right here in Ottawa. And the federal government and the Status of Women were great to give a grant to if you wanted to have a conference. But if you wanted to actually help to prevent violence against women and to give women a refuge from violence, there was no money. So I think it's a question of priorities, and hopefully the fact that we didn't cut health care and we gave a 6% increase to Ontario for the budget for health care will give them some additional flexibility. Instead of cutting them by $25 billion, the provinces will have a bit more flexibility to meet some of these demands, which I think are really important.

[The Chair, Liberal, Diane Marleau]

Your time is up, sir.

We're now going to Mr. Alghabra.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Minister, thank you for coming.

I just have to say something. The credibility of a Conservative talking about fiscal management and financial prudence is as credible as Mike Harris's promise to open up more hospitals in Ontario. Canadians have not forgotten about the highest level of deficits and debt that the previous Conservative federal government accumulated. And we in Ontario are still trying to recover from the previous fiscal shambles in Ontario.

So my question to you is, why did you shut down the court challenges program?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Other than the slander that preceded the question, I don't recall Mike Harris ever campaigning to open more hospitals.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

That's credibility. It would be the same level of credibility if he were to say that. Don't miss the point.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Why did you--

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Forget the drive-by smear. Let's move on to my question.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

This is not a drive-by smear. Imagine if Mike Harris promised to open up more hospitals, what kind of credibility would he have?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Well, if you go down Carling Avenue, you'll see a brand-new Royal Ottawa Hospital that I was very pleased to announce with the Minister of Finance at the time, Jim Flaherty, and with the Minister of Health at the time, Tony Clement. The opening is going to be happening on November 1, and I hope you can make it. It's a great new hospital. It's state of the art. It's lovely. It's a P3, too.

I know McGuinty promised to get rid of the P3s, but it's a great new hospital. You should come to my riding and see the Queensway-Carleton Hospital and see the great expansion at the hospital.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

I have to tell you, I occasionally enjoy your theatrics, but now I'm still looking for your answer. Why did you shut down the court challenges program?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

We made a decision that we would rather put those funds to work for people in line for medical treatment. We made a decision to put those funds in line for a cancer control strategy. We made the decision that we would rather increase the tax credit support for families with disabled children. We would rather spend the money on those three areas than on the area you mentioned.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga—Erindale, ON]

Minister, I mentioned the court challenges program, $2.3 million a year. You know that's one trip that the Prime Minister makes overseas, so to tell me that this cut has any financial impact on the budget is hollow. Tell me, really, why did you shut down the court challenges program?

[John Baird, Conservative, Ottawa West—Nepean, ON]

Maybe in your world $2.5 million isn't a lot of money, but for the hardworking people I represent in Ottawa West—Nepean, you bet your boots it is. What about the equality of a young disabled child whose parents need a bit of support? What about the equality of someone on a waiting list for heart surgery who has a heart attack because they've been waiting for a year and a half? What about the equality of someone waiting for cancer care? We made a legitimate decision to put more money into health care and less money into that area, and some will agree and some will disagree. We didn't do what the Liberal government did, which was to cut health care by $25 billion.