Government Operations Committee on Dec. 3rd, 2009

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Here is the letter. Would you like to see it?

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Absolutely. I'm sure it's in French and English so that everyone can see it.

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

I have a French copy here. I'll follow up with it. That may be the only English copy.

May I ask a different question, then?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Yes, sure.

Yes, Mr. Brown.

[Patrick Brown, Conservative, Barrie, ON]

Given that we're referencing this document, it would be helpful if copies could be made for everyone on the committee so we can understand what this mystery document is.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Fair enough. It's a letter from Madam Hall Findlay to the minister, and it's in both official languages. Because the minister does not have the document....

I'm going to be fair to the minister. Ministers receive a lot of correspondence. He probably does not know which letter it is, so for his benefit I would like to have it in front of him so that when he goes back to his office and sees the letter, at least he knows what it is. Thank you.

Madam Hall Findlay, continue with another line of questioning.

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

It is a different line of questioning, but again, it relates to our being asked to approve significant additional spending on advertising. I want us to be assured, as parliamentarians, that the advertising is being done properly.

Under the Competition Act, the private sector is under very strict rules about misleading advertising. In fact, it is against the law to engage in false or misleading advertising in any material respect.

I note that there has been significant advertising about the creation of jobs. Could I ask the minister, please, what facts the government has in order that it can advertise that it has been creating jobs?

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

I believe the Minister of Finance addressed that particular issue, in fact, as late as yesterday. I will get you the evidence on which he based his statements. I don't have that, other than anecdotal evidence I received, for example, from the Premier of Manitoba when we were making an announcement together in June. That would have been the former Premier of Manitoba, Premier Doer.

If you could just let me explain what....

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

I'm not interested in anecdotal evidence, sir. I'm asking for hard evidence.

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

This is hard evidence. If you can't take the word of an NDP premier, who can you take the word of? What the Premier of Manitoba told me was that the number of construction jobs in Manitoba--I assume this is on an annualized basis--was 38,000 as of June of this year, compared to 36,000 the previous year. He indicated to me that this was a result of the joint stimulus funding the federal, provincial, and municipal governments had been spending.

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

That is a whopping 2,000 jobs.

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Yes, and that's important to 2,000 people. If you don't think it's important--

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

It is, sir, but if I may remind you, you've made promises of, at one time, 190,000 jobs and at another of 210,000. You've been advertising that you've been creating jobs. I asked a simple question, and you've made a commitment. Can I have a timeframe during which you will provide the substantive evidence of the job creation you have been advertising? I would like a commitment. I would like a timeframe.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Your time is up, Madam Hall Findlay.

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

I will take your question, and I'll ask the officials to check with Finance to see what information is available to you, and the information that is available to you will be provided to you.

[Martha Hall Findlay, Liberal, Willowdale, ON]

At what point in time?

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Madam Hall Findlay--

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

I can't speak for the officials. Perhaps the officials could give you that timeframe.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

I just need clarification. Does advertising come as part of your estimates, or is it Finance? What's your role in this? Before I rule that a question is irrelevant, I need your clarification, and you can help me out here.

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

It's a difficult question to answer, because advertising is in each department. So it depends on—

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Does Treasury Board advertise?

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Not that I'm aware of. I can find out whether we have been advertising, but I'm not aware of any advertising.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Okay. When you feel that a question may not be relevant to the estimates, you can say so and then we will have a discussion.

Thanks.

[Vic Toews, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

I just didn't want to make it look like I was withholding evidence or anything.

[The Chair, Liberal, Yasmin Ratansi]

Okay, thank you. We're trying to be fair here.

Madame Bourgeois, for eight minutes.