Evidence of meeting #26 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 40th Parliament, 3rd session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was know.
A recording is available from Parliament.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
You want to be clear with this committee that everything you say is true.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
You said you didn't hand out your business cards. In a question from my colleague, Mr. Martin, on April 21, you said you never circulated your MP's business card after you ceased to be an MP. Yet we know later that was not true.
Green Power Generation Corporation
Right. Let me go back. I don't think you were here at the committee when I addressed this particular issue.
NDP
Green Power Generation Corporation
No, but just in today's appearance, one of the things that I said happened with that particular business card—and it was qualified to the people at that meeting that day, because this wasn't a habit. I would not hand out a business card that—
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
So you put a caveat on it. You said, “Here's this card. Use it.”
Green Power Generation Corporation
I said, “Here's a collector's item that happens to be in my jacket.” Why would I advertise I was a loser?
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I want to get at this point: you said you never paid for lobbying. Was there a notion that if a contract had been successfully granted to any of the companies you spoke of, you would then receive payment afterwards?
Green Power Generation Corporation
No, we never even got to that stage because we never put in a formal application for any funding.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I don't understand, Rahim, why you don't think it's lobbying. We have the e-mail exchange between you and Brian Jean, the parliamentary secretary who was engaged in this fund, which was the fund some of the companies you represented were interested in. You said:
Have you had a chance to look at the proposal for our solar project and power systems. Our preference is for the solar if there needs to be a choice between the two.
In expressing the preference, in expressing the choice, in expressing the interest, do you not see that as lobbying for one project over another? I don't see how, as an experienced member of Parliament, you can't see talking to a parliamentary secretary in charge of the funding as lobbying.
Green Power Generation Corporation
—I appreciate this question because there is some explanation. There is a process for the green fund where you submit proposals. It goes through the minister's office. It goes through the bureaucracy. If it has merit, it's considered to go forward. If it has merit, then you are supposed to put in a formal application for funding.
None of our projects ever made it that far, but I understood that in telling Mr. Jean, these are our projects, these are some things we're interested in.... I wasn't paid on behalf of anyone to find out which ones may or may not be of interest to the government; that would constitute lobbying. This is what I've always maintained.
You can find out information from any government department, any individual you know in government. Unless you're paid to change anything or to ask for anything, unless you're paid—
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
You're doing it for free, so you're a lobbyist for free.
Green Power Generation Corporation
That's exactly what.... I wasn't a lobbyist. My business was trying to determine what sort of work we were going to do.
Green Power Generation Corporation
That's why I never took a contract from anybody to do any of this work before I determined what kind of business we would do.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Yasmin Ratansi
Thank you.
Before I go to Mr. Warkentin, I just want to read something, and I want a clarification because I think it deals with...that we are operating under a truthful model here. The committee had asked, and I'll read you the motion that was adopted by the committee:
That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(1)(a) and in relation to the Committee's study of renewable energy project funding by the Government, Rahim Jaffer be ordered to provide the Committee with all papers and records, both electronic and hard copy, from 2008 until today, as they relate to Green Power Generation Corp.'s list of clients, as well as any companies that Rahim Jaffer had discussions with in relation to green technologies, and as they relate to Green Power Generation Corp. and its partners and any government officials, either elected or not, and to the business of Nazim Gillani and International Strategic Investments with respect to involvement with the Government, and that the said material be delivered to the Committee within five (5) business days.
Now Mr. Gillani has given us the back-and-forth communication between you and him. I understand from the clerk that we haven't received anything like that from you. Before the committee does anything that requires a report, I would ask you the question for clarification: why didn't you comply with that order?
Green Power Generation Corporation
I think I did, because I did submit anything that dealt with government or GPG, around the caveat of what the production of papers was--
Liberal
Green Power Generation Corporation
That's right. If it had anything to do with government, I sent it in. I did not send in any personal e-mails relating to other business, because Mr. Gillani has the choice, I guess, to divulge all the business e-mails or any correspondence we've ever had. But according to what you asked for in the production of papers, I produced everything that was related to the study.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Yasmin Ratansi
Fair enough. We'll take it under advisement in camera.
Mr. Warkentin for five minutes.