Government Operations Committee on Nov. 24th, 2011

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Mr. President, and the witnesses.

I'm just following up on Mr. Casey's comment about not only focusing on our expenses, but also our revenue sources. I just met with tourism officials this week and talked about the United States. Their visa centres are actually revenue centres. They're taking $200 million and starting a national travel or tourism initiative. We're very concerned about that from an economic and competitive perspective. We have to look at other ways of raising revenue as well, so I'll put that out there.

I just wanted to clarify the numbers. It was indicated that we spent $266 billion last year and that it will be about $259 billion this year. So there was about a $7 billion reduction in overall expenditures. Is that correct?

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

The total estimates to date, yes, are $259.4 billion. Obviously, we are not at the end of the fiscal year yet. So I would caution that other expenses may be exigible in the future until we get to March 31. That is my understanding.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Where would it break down at to where those savings would be?

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

What the delta is between the $266 billion and $259 billion? If my colleagues could help me on that a little bit, that would be helpful.

[Bill Matthews]

The biggest change, Mr. Chair, is the winding down of the economic action plan. In the previous year, you would have seen some funding still around the economic action plan. There is still some that has been reprofiled, but that's certainly winding down.

It's also challenging to compare estimates to estimates in the middle of the year, because the timing of when something is included in the estimates depends very much upon when the department can bring together its materials for a Treasury Board submission and get approval to go ahead. It's really difficult, in the middle of a year, to compare the two, but I would say the easiest point to focus on is the economic action plan.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Thank you.

In another area, the Treasure Board is requesting $4.1 billion to improve financial systems. They're looking at areas of inefficiencies. Another one is $5.6 million for the Red Tape Reduction Commission. They talk about revenue opportunities. It's helping businesses to be more efficient. One way, I hear from constituents, is making it easier for us to do business.

I've attended a panel of the Red Tape Reduction Commission when they came to British Columbia. Some of our interprovincial trade barriers are the biggest ones, especially coming from the wine industry. We know it's making it's way through, but maybe you could share with the committee what are the expected savings that could be achieved through this commission.

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Yes, sure, they do have a number. I think the CFIB, which is obviously the small independent business--

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

The Canadian Federation of Independent Business....

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

--do have a number. I don't have it off the top of my head, but if somebody could whisper that to me, it would be great. But there is a calculation that can be made in terms of what they call administrative burden, and what the rest of us call red tape. It does cause costs in terms of small business, diverting their ability to hire more employees and expand their operations, and what have you.

So it has been calculated. There's some good research in this area. There's no question that there is an amount. It's in the billions-of-dollars range.

[A voice]

[Inaudible--Editor]

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

They say $10 billion--so there you go--is lost to the economy as a result of administrative burden generally.

I would like to think the federal government is a subset of that $10-billion number, because obviously there are provincial and municipal red-tape issues as well. That's why the Honourable Maxime Bernier and I are working hand in glove with CFIB and other stakeholders with this Red Tape Reduction Commission, and there will be some very interesting proposals coming out of it very soon.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Well, I'm excited about that.

Another encouraging initiative the government has taken is Shared Services Canada. Perhaps you could share with the committee a little information as far as the document on Shared Services Canada is concerned.

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Shared Services Canada was announced by me and Minister Ambrose in July, I believe, of this year. Finally after years of preparation and discussion, it is the consolidation of not all, but much, of the IT services found in the Government of Canada.

I would pose it to you this way, Mr. Cannan. What we have in the Government of Canada right now are 100 different email systems and 300 different data centres and, I believe, 3,000 different IT networks. Some consolidation is needed. It actually will make the Government of Canada more efficient. It will save money. It will increase the morale of the public service. And it will increase the morale of your constituents, because as they're dealing with government on a face-to-face basis, when IT is working properly and is working in sync, that will make a big difference. So that's the role of Shared Services Canada. And they will be rolling out their business plans in the weeks and months ahead.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Thank you, Mr. President.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

Thank you, Minister.

Thank you, Ron. That concludes your time.

Who's next? The NDP, Denis Blanchette.

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Thank you for being here with us, Minister.

In your preliminary remarks, you said that to help you achieve the budget cuts of several billion dollars that have been announced, you have signed a $15.5 million outside contract.

Given that we have a professional, skilled public service, one of the best in the world, what is the firm that has been retained going to do above and beyond your public service?

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Certainly the public service will provide information and advice, given their professionalism, undoubtedly, but it is common practice, in the private sector and the other public sectors, to get other opinions that may improve the process. Because they are another set of eyes, not the eyes of people who work in our world. It is a different point of view.

I would just say to you that it's another set of eyes, as I said. It gives another set of advice from another point of view. These particular individuals have been assisting not only the private sector but also the public sector around the world with these sorts of exercises. It's not replacing the advice of the--

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

So then, Minister, what kind of target are you giving these people? Are you having them target the budget cuts you have ordered or are you having them target the transformation of public services, as you outlined earlier?

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Ms. d'Auray, can you answer, please?

[Michelle d'Auray]

The consultants have experience in reviewing internal processes, operations and operational costs. Over the years, there has been a tendency to increase the number of people every time there is a new program, to do more or less the same thing.

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Excuse me, Ms. d'Auray, but the question was about the firm's mandate.

[Michelle d'Auray]

There is no target. We are doing it to help us develop the necessary methodologies for making the best proposals for reducing operational expenditures, eliminating redundancies and consolidating everything to establish standards for our processes.

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

And so the purpose of this contract is first and foremost to carry out a budget cutting operation. That is what I understand.

[Michelle d'Auray]

We are trying to establish best practices.

[Denis Blanchette, NDP, Louis-Hébert, QC]

Yes, I agree.

I imagine they are already at work, is that right? I would like to get an idea of where they are in their exercise, of when they are going to produce their report and when you are going to announce the results of this work.