Government Operations Committee on April 30th, 2012

[Marc Bélisle]

That was in our mains.

When we were doing our main estimates, they were saying they would be finishing in June, so that was the money to be able to finish as of June. But they're saying that within that they'll still be able to finish within their estimated amount of $26.4 million.

[Michelle Doucet]

I would just add that I think it's only the commissioner who knows when he will be finished. He has asked the Prime Minister for an extension to the end of September and the Prime Minister granted that extension.

[Ron Cannan, Conservative, Kelowna—Lake Country, BC]

Thank you very much. I appreciate it.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

Thank you.

Thank you very much to our witnesses from the Privy Council Office for the information about the main estimates. We appreciate your presentation and your being with us here today.

We'll excuse you as witnesses

I know that John wanted the floor for a moment.

Did you want to speak about whether or not we should be entertaining the votes that have been referred to us now or postpone that for a later date, John?

[John McCallum, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Thank you very much.

According to the Standing Orders, we're supposed to have the reports on plans and priorities to consider before voting on the main estimates. According to the government, those reports will be out next week. I think we have several weeks still available before we have to vote on the mains or before they're deemed approved.

I would suggest that it's not necessary to do it today. We should have an opportunity to consider the RPPs first.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

I think you've already won Mr. Wallace over with such a compelling argument.

[John McCallum, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

That should be sufficient if his colleagues follow him.

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

No, that's not true.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

Wait a minute.

If I could, just before I recognize Linda, it is true that we have until the end of next month to deal with the main estimates. We have not yet heard from Environment, Heritage, HRSDC, and three or four others, at least. We have heard from Treasury Board and Public Works.

[John McCallum, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

I guess my point is that we don't have to vote before we get the reports on plans and priorities. We're the ones doing the study and should be setting a good example. I don't see why we should break the Standing Orders to do that.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

You're right.

I caution you. You are gilding the lily, sir. You might lose support if you keep up with this.

[John McCallum, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

Linda.

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

To that matter, the votes deal with the questions that I raised. I don't think it's appropriate for us to be voting unless we can put those questions.

What is the possibility, in the next couple of weeks, that we can slide those officials in? I don't think it's going to take a huge amount of time.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

That's an excellent point—not to interrupt you, but....

[Linda Duncan, NDP, Edmonton Strathcona, AB]

If we could delay our long study in order to finish the estimates, that would be helpful.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

The clerk handed me this recommendation as a directive. He says, “By the end of May, the committee is going to be hearing from Environment, Heritage, and HRSDC for their main estimates.”

If members want to pose questions on organizations that fall within the rubric of those departments, and if they let us know by Monday, May 7, we can make sure that those particular agencies or institutions are represented so that you can pose specific questions to them.

In the interest of the two questions you had that weren't answered, I think it's perfectly in order for us to go back to PCO and ask to have that information by the time we vote on their estimates.

Mike.

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

It's really not PCO's decision. If we want to invite the electoral officer to come to talk about his estimates, we can do it.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

It's a reasonable expectation that when you are dealing with the PCO's main estimates, and that's a category of the main estimates, you can ask a question on that—

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

No, not when they're an officer of government.

I have been around here six years, and—

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

Her question wasn't about—

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

Let me finish, Mr. Chair.

I have been around here six years, and in every committee, when you want someone other than the main group to come concerning whatever is in here, you invite them. There's nothing wrong with inviting them. I'm okay with Linda's inviting them.

My suggestion is that when we have these other groups come, whether it's Environment or whatever, let's invite them in the same set of meetings.

We only have a few meetings left on the study of the main estimates. I'd like to get it done so that our researchers can do a report and we can get that done before we leave at the end of June.

I think there's room in the meetings we have set up already to invite people we didn't hear from today, in addition to those we have; that was my point. If we want to invite the electoral officer, we'll invite him to one of the meetings that are available for those other groups. That's my recommendation.

And the clerk made an excellent point. When you're looking at the estimates, if there is an organization within the umbrella of that ministry and you want to see that organization—I made the point that even that little secretariat that has $6 million has its own administration—you have to invite them to do it. That's the way it has been, not just in this committee but in others.

The only other, and final, point that I want to make is that this committee has the authority to approve the main estimates only on a number of things: PCO, Public Works, and Treasury Board.

For the other ones, we don't actually...the committees they report to approve their main estimates. We don't approve their main estimates.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

Well, Mike—

[Mike Wallace, Conservative, Burlington, ON]

I want you to check on that before the next meeting.

[The Chair, NDP, Pat Martin]

—I have the votes here. As the chair of the committee, I have the votes here, and there are five votes under Canadian Heritage, there is a vote under the Governor General, there is a vote under Parliament, under Public Works, and under Treasury Board.