Government Operations Committee on Feb. 27th, 2019

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Colleagues, we're going to start again.

For the benefit of everyone around the table, we will be adjourning at 5:30 p.m. sharp, which gives us a bit of a truncated second tranche of questions and answers.

Mr. Matthews, I understand you have a bit of an abbreviated statement. If you could get into that, and then we'll try to get to our questions as quickly as possible.

[Bill Matthews]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We circulated a deck to all members in advance of the meeting, both I and the deputy minister from Shared Services Canada, just to situate the hearing on estimates.

You have three things in front of you: the plan for 2017-18, which seems like a long time ago—our results; the supplementary estimates for the current year; and interim estimates for the upcoming fiscal year. That's all bundled into one hearing.

If you have the deck in front of you, I'll take you very quickly to slide 3. This is a PSPC slide. I want to flag where we are. In authorities to date, plus supplementary estimates (B), in relation to the previous year, we're up about 2%. So PSPC, as a department, is basically seeking, or on track for, 2% more authorities than it had the previous fiscal year.

On slide 4, some of this has been touched on, but here are the highlights in terms of what we are seeking in supplementary estimates (B): new authorities related to card acceptance and postage fees; some space requirements for Government of Canada employees, $28 million; some adjustments to existing authorities, which relates to revenue from sales of real property, and we're happy to speak about what those properties are; and some authorities related to the pay system. Then there are some transfers back and forth between PSPC and other departments. The big one in there relates to a transfer from the National Research Council for contracting work around the build in Canada innovation program.

On slide 5, 2019-20, the upcoming fiscal year....

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Could we have pages rather than the slide numbers, if you don't mind?

[Bill Matthews]

It should be slide—

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Sorry, is that page 5?

[Bill Matthews]

That should be page 5, yes, mes excuses.

In terms of the interim estimates, the money the department needs to kick-start the upcoming fiscal year, it's a formulaic approach. We basically take the authorities for the current fiscal year and ask for a fraction of those. For our operating dollars we're asking for four-twelfths, if I have that right, Marty. For our capital, we're asking for three-twelfths just to get it started.

Next is slide 7, or page 7. I know sometimes the departmental results frameworks are a little bit confusing to follow, so we have a crosswalk for you about our previous results framework and how it relates to the strategic outcome and program alignments. Current results are on the left and old program names are on the right, to allow you to do that crosswalk.

I apologize for the whirlwind tour through the deck.

Paul, is there anything you want to add on Shared Services Canada?

[Paul Glover]

Thank you very much. I would say very briefly that slides 10 through 12 speak to the $26.9 million increase that Shared Services is looking for. It's about a 1.3% increase, as the minister said earlier. That's for cybersecurity, just a little over $23 million. There is some $2.2 million for core technologies that we provide to the public service. As more public servants come on, there are basic, core technologies we provide for them, and some work we're doing on secure phones and technologies. That is what is enunciated on slides 10 through 12.

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Excellent. We'll go directly into our questions, and start with Madam Mendès, for seven minutes, please.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair, and thank you to all of you for being here.

I would like to start with the work being done by TBS, in collaboration with PSPC, about the new pay system. What's being done? What has been part of the estimates you put in this budget? You've invested a lot of money in Phoenix, and in stabilizing Phoenix. I get it. I understand why, but what is being done now for the new pay system? What is the expected timeline around that?

Perhaps Mr. Linklater could respond.

[Les Linklater]

Mr. Chair, as you will recall, Treasury Board Secretariat was allocated $16 million over two years in budget 2018 to explore options for the next-generation pay system. That work is being led by the chief information officer, Alex Benay, at Treasury Board Secretariat. There are connections with the work we're doing on stabilization, because we do need to have a stable system with data integrity prior to launching a new system, whether on a pilot basis or what have you. Treasury Board has engaged in an agile procurement process to determine whether or not there is software that would be able to function in support of the Government of Canada's pay environment. They are going through a gating process to winnow down the number of vendors who would potentially be able to provide that kind of support, whether as a unique vendor or multiple vendors.

In terms of specific detail, I wouldn't want to go too far without referring to the experts. I would recommend Mr. Benay and the Treasury Board Secretariat for further detail on their process and their go-forward strategy.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

You are collaborating on this measure.

[Les Linklater]

Absolutely.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Thank you very much.

I would now like to go to the defence procurement aspect, and how that has been changed, and how it has evolved for the past year and a half. First of all, what steps have been achieved, and what is the immediate future looking like in terms of defence procurement? I know that the minister spoke about the interim fighter jets, and the procurement for the new ones, but shipbuilding is also a big part of the government procurement process.

I would be very happy to hear from you, Mr. Fillion, if you would like, or Mr. Matthews.

[Bill Matthews]

Mr. Chair, maybe I could start and then kick it to my colleague André to correct me when I misspeak.

In terms of defence procurement the minister did highlight, as you've mentioned, the ships and news around jets. The next large procurement coming up is around future air crew training. That's under way, and we can maybe get Mr. Fillion to comment on that. That's the next big one.

In terms of process fixes in how we make defence procurement more efficient, the most recent innovation is around a risk-based-authorities approach.

PSPC, in conjunction with DND procurement—only when the two of them are collaborating.... Treasury Board has put in place new authorities which basically give us more scope to do procurement, without going to Treasury Board for approvals. About 150 factors get applied in the procurements. If it's low enough risk, or medium complexity, we've freed up some process there. That will make procurement more efficient going forward. Treasury Board retains the right to pull in any procurement they want for a discussion and approval.

That's the most recent innovation on defence procurement.

André, is there anything you want to add?

[André Fillion, Assistant Deputy Minister, Defence and Marine Procurement, Acquisitions Program, Department of Public Works and Government Services]

You mentioned the next major procurement, the future air crew training which is basically to replace the pilot training contracts that we have in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, and in Southport, Manitoba, and also some of the training that occurs in Winnipeg by the air force, by one large, all-encompassing air crew training system that would come into place in the 2020s.

Before the holidays we had narrowed down the list of suppliers. We're engaging constantly at the moment to develop their request for proposal which we would like to issue early next year.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Mr. Fillion, does this have anything at all to do with the current shortage of pilots? I know that is not why you will be moving your training centre. I assume that is a question of efficiency. However, we know that there is a major pilot shortage. Do you feel that it will be a way to resolve the shortage in the air force?

[André Fillion]

I would like to clarify that the location of the training will not change. However, all contracts will be combined into a single training system for all pilots. When we reach the point of determining the contractual requirements of the entrepreneurs who are interested, we will certainly consider the future needs of the Royal Canadian Air Force for pilot and air crew training. In the meantime, the current contracts continue to meet the needs, and the RCAF handles them.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Do I have any time left?

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

One minute.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Oh, yes, another very fascinating aspect of what you do at PSPC is maintaining federal properties.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

I've been waiting for this moment.

[Alexandra Mendes, Liberal, Brossard—Saint-Lambert, QC]

Well, actually, it does interest me.

As part of our history and as part of how we try to build a history in this country, which is quite new, quite young, the minister mentioned that there has been some streamlining of property, sales, and some revenue that was generated through the sale of some properties, to maintain and better restore other properties.

Which one of you would be willing to touch on that? I would be happy to hear about it. The sales and the—

[The Chair, Conservative, Tom Lukiwski]

Unfortunately, it will be none of you since we're completely out of time, but you may like to respond in writing to the clerk following this meeting.

We'll now go to Mr. McCauley for seven minutes, please.

[Kelly McCauley, Conservative, Edmonton West, AB]

Great. Thank you.

Mr. Matthews, we're talking about the interim estimates. In your interim estimates, when you say three months of 12, is that three of 12 of next year's projected spending, or based on this year's year-to-date spending?

[Bill Matthews]

It's based on the current year authorities. Correct me if I'm wrong, Mr. Muldoon. Yes, we have that right. Basically, we take our estimates in terms of what we have asked for to date from Parliament—so not spent but to date.