Evidence of meeting #42 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 42nd Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was mail.
NDP
Sheila Malcolmson NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
Finally, do any of the panellists have any comments on the proposals around broadband being included in the Canada Post package, following on the reflections about inadequate access and some communities still being reliant on dial-up?
National Director, Pacific Region, Canadian Union of Postal Workers
I think you just have to look at other countries that are doing this. In Italy, for example, they have PosteMobile. They do sell Internet. They are bringing in profits. In 2015 it was 31 million euros, which is up from 14 million euros in 2014.
The French also have a system, La Poste Mobile. It now holds 1.3 million telephone lines. They had an increase of 10% over 2015, as of June of this year. La Poste Mobile revenue increased 6.4% at the end of June 2016.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Tom Lukiwski
Thank you very much.
Mr. Whalen, from the east coast to the west.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Yes, Mr. Chair, and it's wonderful to be here. I'm operating on a few different time zones right now, so hopefully I'll be able to keep my questions on point.
I really want to focus on the future of Canada Post. Even if we don't accept the numbers provided by the task force 100%, we do know there are very severe structural issues facing Canada Post, from the aging workforce, to the pension liability, to the reduction in demand for mail as a service. Trying to find new revenue sources for Canada Post and to provide new opportunities for middle-class jobs is important, as is leveraging the value of the brand.
Ms. Huberman, you have a lot of experience in the business community in a growing metropolis. What types of services, from broadband initiatives provided through Canada Post, the banking provided through Canada Post, to logistics services provided through Canada Post do you think your members would actually use?
Chief Executive Officer, Surrey Board of Trade
Well, I think all of the above. It's about identifying what specific businesses need. The highest number of manufacturers in British Columbia are housed right here in Surrey. They have different needs. Our charities and non-profits have different needs.
I think, from an industry perspective, it's identifying what those services are, packaging them, and making sure that you utilize business organizations and other stakeholders to market them to the community.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Do you believe that Canada Post has the expertise and the ability to compete with the banks and to compete with broadband providers and Internet service providers in a competitive way in this market in British Columbia?
Chief Executive Officer, Surrey Board of Trade
I think it's starting to. One of our survey respondents indicated that they are utilizing the online marketing program that Canada Post is engaging in. Even at our national convention at the Canadian Chamber of Commerce, it was articulated that there are many businesses that are starting to utilize the expertise of Canada Post, but many are not aware of it, and it's the awareness issue that is integral.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
That's wonderful. Thank you very much.
Mr. Armstrong, you talked about profits at Canada Post over the past two decades, which is great, but then we also look at some of the things that management has done to streamline, offering to introduce community mailboxes to save $80 million a year and moving sorting to larger facilities in an effort to maintain profitability. Does past management practice deserve any of the credit for the profits that have been realized within the corporation over the last decade?
National Director, Pacific Region, Canadian Union of Postal Workers
Well, I think Canada Post has done a good job of shovelling money off the back of the truck, if you ask me, but I suppose they are managing the business, and they have done a few things that have improved that, and the union has contributed to that.
I don't think reducing delivery from five days a week would be a good thing. It's not good for businesses that want to get their product and services to their customers. While some people may be moving to online for cheques, invoices, and things, they still rely on that coming back to them to make sure their revenues are coming in and that they're getting their invoices out to their customers so they can get their payment from that.
It's also a bad thing for Canada Post to reduce delivery. I'm just going to say this. Having a parcel delivered by Canada Post can cause up to six times less CO2 emissions than an overnight delivery by a courier.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Mr. Armstrong, you don't need to convince me on that.
I'm going to move on to some of the other opportunities for saving money.
The task force pointed out mailbox conversion. Do you see some type of convergence there between the workforce reductions that are going to happen through aging? It looks like about 25% of the workforce will retire over this window that we're talking about. Can that be synergistically done so that the community mailbox conversion can be timed with employee retirement so that it has less impact on the workforce, but we can still get these cost savings and streamline the service delivery?
National Director, Pacific Region, Canadian Union of Postal Workers
Well, again, we're opposed to community mailboxes. We don't think they have anything to do with communities, quite frankly. It's more of a self-serve option. Coming into the community, we are going to have a few reductions in staff, obviously, but Canada Post is hiring repeatedly. There are constantly new schools for training, etc.
The safest, most convenient way of getting your mail is to your home, especially with parcel delivery now. If we're going to—
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Ms. Huberman, in this neighbourhood in Surrey, do people mostly get home delivery, or is it mostly community mailboxes?
Chief Executive Officer, Surrey Board of Trade
It's a combination. It depends how densified each area is.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Have your members complained about the differential service between community mailboxes and home delivery?
Chief Executive Officer, Surrey Board of Trade
I haven't heard anything, no.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Ms. Stern, I really like this notion of the strong brand of Canada Post and how it can be leveraged.
Do you feel there's any material difference between accessing Canada Post services through franchise outlets, such as at a Shoppers Drug Mart or some other pharmacy, or some other type of co-branded store, versus having the brand of Canada Post be the most prominent feature of the service offering?
Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Simon Fraser University
As an urban resident, it's very difficult to say. I live in New Westminster, and we don't have a Canada Post outlet. We have only a franchise. They're convenient, but it's not a Canada Post person. It's somebody in a Shoppers Drug Mart uniform. It is the face of the government, but it isn't, so it does—
Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Simon Fraser University
It undermines the brand a bit. I don't see us necessarily going back to having—
Liberal
Assistant Professor, Department of Sociology and Anthropology, Simon Fraser University
I do get good service when I go there, and I assume most Canadians get good service.
Liberal
Nick Whalen Liberal St. John's East, NL
Just as a point, for the people who haven't had the opportunity to participate in as many of these meetings as some of us have, we have heard from the corporation and the unions, and many business leaders, that alternate-day delivery from the recipient's perspective is okay, but from the real customers of Canada Post, who are the people sending the mail, they want daily delivery. Otherwise, they would move their service to another provider, because customers demand that.
I would just like to remind people of what we've already heard.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Tom Lukiwski
Thank you, Mr. Whalen.
We'll now go to our last two intervenors. They will be five minutes each, and we'll start with Ms. Watts.
Conservative
Dianne Lynn Watts Conservative South Surrey—White Rock, BC
Thank you very much. I appreciate it, and it's an interesting conversation. I'm just subbing in today.
I heard from you, Tim, that you're opposed to community mailboxes. In the city of Surrey, and as the former mayor, I can't remember when we didn't have them, except maybe back in the sixties or seventies.
If it's saving $80 million a year, why is that a bad thing?
National Director, Pacific Region, Canadian Union of Postal Workers
I guess it's a matter of what the reason for Canada Post is. We're in business to serve Canadians and to bring mail and parcels to people's homes, not to community mailboxes.
As you are probably aware, being the mayor of Surrey, Surrey is the crime capital or theft capital of the community. I'm not talking about all crime; I mean for community mailbox theft. It's the community mailbox theft capital—