Government Operations Committee on March 24th, 2021

[The Chair, Conservative, Robert Gordon Kitchen]

Thank you.

We'll now go to Ms. Vignola for six minutes.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Madam Minister, thank you for joining us today. It's a pleasure to be able to talk to you.

I'm going to go back quickly to the ventilators. We know we have ordered too many.

How many FTI Professional Grade ventilators have we received so far?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

I would just clarify that at the beginning of the pandemic it wasn't clear how many ventilators would be necessary to prepare for any eventuality to respond to the pandemic. These contracts were put in place about a year ago, prior to the information coming forward which we now have, and which I guess leads to your question.

In addition, on the number, we have received over 27,000 ventilators, and for the precise number from FTI, I will hand it to Bill Matthews.

[Bill Matthews, Deputy Minister, Department of Public Works and Government Services]

Thank you, Madam Minister.

We have received 10,000 FTI Professional Grade ventilators, but I am not sure whether the client has checked the quality of all those we have received.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Okay.

If we have to return excess, unused ventilators, will we receive a refund?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Thank you for your question.

We have spoken with the suppliers about this.

As I said, we have already received over 27,000 ventilators.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

If we have to return ventilators, or not accept new ones, will we receive a refund?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

The important point to note is that we had contracts with these ventilator companies, and we have received a significant portion of the ventilators. We are continuing discussions with them with regard to the items that we have not received as of yet.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

So the payments have been made.

Will we receive a refund if we do not receive the ventilators?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

We will make sure that we are not paying for items that we are not receiving, but I will say that these are contracts that were executed last year at the request of ISED and the Public Health Agency of Canada and that negotiation includes those departments.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

On behalf of taxpayers, I just hope that some of the companies from which we have already purchased the ventilators will not be able to double their profit on items that have been paid for and that ultimately will not need to be delivered.

Now let's talk about vaccines. What is the average price of vaccines in Canada?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

To respond to the ventilator point that you made, we have to recognize that when ISED negotiated with the companies for the provision of ventilators, it was standing up domestic capacity. Canadians want product that is made in Canada, ventilators and other PPE that are made in Canada. That was at the heart of making sure we were ready for this pandemic.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you. That's very clear.

I just hope that taxpayers are not being ripped off. I was just saying that we wouldn't want a company whose ventilators were bought by the government to resell the ones that are not used elsewhere. That would be a shame.

What is the average price of vaccines?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

I understand, and I want to assure this committee, and through you the House of Commons, that I have the Canadian taxpayers' interests at heart when I am doing my job. I am very concerned with that issue myself.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you. What is the average price of vaccines, please?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Thank you very much.

I would like to begin by saying that we entered into seven agreements for vaccines and will make sure that we are continuing to provide information, as we are able to, in terms of the confidentiality which we must keep under our agreements. There are a range of prices, and indeed we still have options to purchase under our vaccine contracts. Therefore, it's very difficult to provide an average at this time, although I will ask my deputy minister if he has anything to add on that point.

[Bill Matthews]

I'll just add this.

Canada's vaccine portfolio is seven different vaccines, and they're very different. They are across three different technologies, so the prices vary depending on the type of vaccine and the number of vaccine doses you buy.

I don't think it's appropriate for me to offer up an average price at this time.

[The Chair, Conservative, Robert Gordon Kitchen]

Thank you.

We'll now go to Mr. Green for six minutes.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Welcome back, Honourable Minister. It's good to have you here.

I want to pick up on the vaccines. I want to talk a little bit about the investments that have been made in the National Research Council.

Through you, Mr. Chair, what in your opinion, Honourable Minister, does Canada's domestic landscape look like in terms of the potential eventual domestic production of vaccines?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

Thank you so much for that very warm welcome.

I just want to say thank you to the member for Richmond Hill and the member for Hamilton Centre for their advocacy in favour of M-36, which passed unanimously today and which is one of the highlights, I think, that this Parliament has achieved since I've been an MP.

I will move now to the question of domestic production. From a vaccine procurement standpoint, my role has been vis-à-vis the seven advance purchase agreements with the suppliers, which I believe I discussed with you the last time I was at committee. In terms of domestic production, that is a lead that is taken by ISED. Domestic production within Canada is within that ministry.

However, to respond to your question, we are investing over $120 million to expand the National Research Council facility [Technical difficulty—Editor] to produce two million doses a month. This is in addition to $600 million to support the private sector vaccine development and production in Canada.

In addition—

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Can we pause there? Can you just rephrase that? We're doing...how much into the NRC?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

So far it's $126 million or thereabouts.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

And how much into the private sector?

[Anita Anand, Liberal, Oakville, ON]

It's about $600 million, but that is research primarily. It's—

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Would this be tied to post-secondary—I'm thinking universities, perhaps—or is this going directly to the private sector for their research and development to then sell us back the vaccines?