Evidence of meeting #113 for Government Operations and Estimates in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was saskatchewan.
A video is available from Parliament.
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley
I call this meeting to order.
Good morning, everyone. Welcome to meeting number 113 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates, the committee recommended by four out of five parliamentary budget officers.
Pursuant to Standing Order 81(4), the committee is meeting today to commence considering items in the main estimates 2024-25.
We welcome—
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I have been a member of this committee for five years now. I take pride in the work of this committee, and I take particular pride in the fact that this committee has traditionally been collaborative. We work together to get to the bottom of things and to do the work that constituents, residents and Canadians expect us to do. We have always worked together—
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
For the last five years, every single chair—and there have been multiple chairs chairing this committee—has always sought instruction from committee members whenever an action was to be taken. That is a bedrock principle of how this committee—
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
Philip Lawrence Conservative Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON
Mr. Chair, this is not a point of order.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
—has conducted itself for five years.
Mr. Chair, please allow me to continue. This is important.
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
I am.
Last week, a meeting was called without consultation and the instruction of this committee. This week, we had two meetings scheduled without consultation and the instruction or consent of this committee.
A witness today was invited yesterday. We found out about this witness at 7 p.m. last night. There was no consultation, and there was no instruction from this committee. We found out from Global News that there may be another meeting tomorrow, with additional witnesses, and again with no instruction and no consultation.
I am asking the chair to explain that to this committee, because this is completely out of tradition in the way we've operated in the last five years on this committee. This has never—
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
Philip Lawrence Conservative Northumberland—Peterborough South, ON
Mr. Chair, I've been very patient. I have not heard any valid point of order.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
I'd like to ask the chair to explain how this meeting came about. I have a few questions for the chair as to how this meeting came about and what efforts were made by the chair to consult with members of this committee and seek instruction. Furthermore, why is this meeting being held today, during a constituency week, and why is this witness before us today?
This is a point of order. This is outside of the tradition of how this committee has conducted itself over the last five years—
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
—and I'd like to get the chair to explain his actions.
11:05 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley
Sure.
First of all, it's not a valid point of order, but I will answer your questions.
The premiers, representing over 60% of the population, wrote to the chair of the finance committee to address the issue of the increase in the carbon tax. The Liberal chair, maybe under political pressure from his own party, refused.
As the premiers are the highest office-holders in their provinces, representing millions and millions of Canadians, I thought we should respect the provinces and invite the premiers to participate in our study of the estimates, which includes the government's spending, including the carbon tax.
There are lots of examples of other chairs doing such things. It is the privilege and the obligation, I think, of the chair to call meetings, and I did so. I'm happy to go through some of the examples of other chairs from government-led parties doing the same, but it is within the prerogative of the chair to call such meetings, and I did, and we're ready to start the meeting.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
Mr. Chair, again, I have a point of order.
Standing Order 108 clearly states that committee members instruct the chair on any action, so I'll ask you this again: What consultation, even basic consultation, did the chair undertake in order to schedule this week's meetings, including the meeting that, again, we hear is going to be scheduled for tomorrow—
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Irek Kusmierczyk Liberal Windsor—Tecumseh, ON
—and to seek instruction from this committee?
I think it's really important because this is a departure. I want folks listening to know that this is a departure from the way we've conducted business at the OGGO committee for five years. This is new.
11:10 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley
It is within the powers and the prerogative of the chair to call meetings, Mr. Kusmierczyk. Our clerk is looking at the exact ruling, if you wish, but it is fully within the powers of the chair.
For example, the Liberal chair of the natural resources committee called a meeting without anyone's knowledge in order to ram through the anti-Alberta, anti-energy industry bill, Bill C-50. It has been done in the past, and—
11:10 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Kelly McCauley
Please let me finish, Mrs. Atwin.
It is fully within the powers of the chair to call such meetings, and I have.
Go ahead, Mrs. Atwin.
11:10 a.m.
Liberal
Jenica Atwin Liberal Fredericton, NB
Mr. Chair, I think you're taking a bit of liberty there by insinuating that the Liberal government was pushing a Liberal chair in another committee to not have these meetings. I'm certain that they were respecting the time and commitments of their committee members—
11:10 a.m.
Conservative