Government Operations Committee on Nov. 21st, 2024

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Did you have discussions with elected officials or the senior management of the process to determine the sale or the purchase?

[Thomas Clark]

No.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Are you aware that a number of properties were reviewed in order to make that decision?

[Thomas Clark]

Yes.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Did you visit all the locations that were being assessed?

[Thomas Clark]

No.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

In regard to the residence that is there now, is it now up for sale?

[Thomas Clark]

It is.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Do you know what approximate value would be netted by the taxpayer?

[Thomas Clark]

Again, I'm not part of that process. My understanding is that it's about $13 million, but I think previous testimony has covered that.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

It certainly has.

The property that you're now being forced to move into.... Frankly, is it less expensive than the one you were in previously?

[Thomas Clark]

It is my understanding that this will save millions of dollars.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

It's approximately $7 million in the net sale and purchase and something like $115,000 a year in savings. That's what we're told, Mr. Clark.

That's a substantive improvement and benefit to Canadians and taxpayers. Would you agree?

[Thomas Clark]

I would think that's a good thing, yes.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Are you able to continue your role in the new residence? It's a prominent position, and it's certainly required by other provinces, premiers and members of governments throughout Canada. Is it a more accessible location and a more effective use of government space?

[Thomas Clark]

Yes. Canada is open for business on West 57th Street.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

I am being told I have to wrap up.

Mr. Clark, thank you for your service and your time. I appreciate you for doing the work you're doing.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Mr. Sousa, thank you very much.

Mr. Clark, thank you for being with us again.

Colleagues, we're going to suspend for a few minutes to excuse Mr. Clark and set up for our next panel. Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Good afternoon. We are back in session.

I'd like to welcome our guests for this part. I understand that there will be opening statements from Heritage Canada.

Please go ahead. You have five minutes.

[Sarah Boily, Director General, Official Languages, Department of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Chair, members of the committee, good morning.

I'd like to start by acknowledging that we are gathered here on the traditional unceded territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe nation.

I am here in response to the invitation you extended to the deputy minister of Canadian Heritage, whom I am replacing here. I am accompanied by Carsten Quell, executive director, and Annie Proulx, director of regulations and policies. They both work at the official languages centre of excellence, within the office of the chief human resources officer, Treasury Board of Canada Secretariat.

I'm speaking to you today in my capacity as director general, official languages, Department of Canadian Heritage.

As you know, Canadian Heritage has various official language responsibilities. As director general, I offer my best advice and input to the assistant deputy minister for official languages, heritage and regions, as well as to the deputy minister of Canadian Heritage within the framework of her mandate as the general administrator of the department. It is our duty, among others, to ensure that Canadian Heritage provides a workplace conducive to the use of both official languages.

The deputy minister also has the mandate to support ministers whose portfolio falls under Canadian Heritage's responsibility. To that end, she supports the Minister of Official Languages by providing her with professional non-partisan advice for the purposes of developing and implementing policies, such as the development of a government-wide official languages strategy commonly called the official languages action plan.

That said, I must point out that changing the linguistic status of 24 additional post offices in the greater Montreal area is beyond the scope of those responsibilities. I therefore defer to my colleagues at Treasury Board Secretariat who are responsible for this file.

I would be pleased to answer any questions which falls under the responsibility of Heritage Canada.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you.

Mr. Quell, go ahead with your opening statement, please.

[Carsten Quell, Executive Director, Official Languages Centre of Excellence, Office of the Chief Human Resources Officer, Treasury Board Secretariat]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you for the opportunity to appear before this committee.

Today, in my brief remarks, I would like to provide some key information on the issue of the linguistic designation of post offices in Quebec.

Our two official languages are at the heart of the Canadian identity. Bilingualism and the protection of French throughout the country are a priority for the Government of Canada.

If I may, I would like to provide a little historical context.

In 2016, the Government of Canada committed to ensuring that more people who speak the minority official language—French-speaking people outside Quebec and English-speaking people in Quebec—could obtain federal services in their language anywhere in the country. This decision led to the launch of the revision of the official languages (communications with and services to the public) regulations.

The regulations establish the circumstances under which federal offices, including a post office, are required to offer their services in English, French or both official languages by determining whether or not there is significant demand in the minority official language. I should add here that the right to receive these services is protected under section 20 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. It is the charter that establishes the concept of “significant demand”.

As part of this revision of the regulations, the Treasury Board Secretariat conducted extensive consultations across the country, including with official language minority communities and with the Office of the Commissioner of Official Languages. These consultations inspired the regulatory amendments that were tabled in both Houses of Parliament in October 2018 and published in the Canada Gazette, part I, shortly thereafter to give the public and all stakeholders the chance to review and comment.

The amended regulations were adopted on June 25, 2019 and include several amendments in response to stakeholder requests.

For example, it uses a more inclusive calculation method to estimate significant demand in the minority official language that considers all those who use the minority official language at home.

The amended regulations also recognize that the existence of an official language minority school is a stable indicator of community vitality and significant demand for minority language services in the region where the school is located.

Federal offices will always offer service in the majority language of the province or territory in which they are located, and they will always offer service in the majority language first. In Quebec, service in federal offices will therefore always be offered first in French.

Let me now take you to today. Most of the amendments to the regulations are in the process of being implemented as part of the official languages regulations reapplication exercise. We call it the OLRRE. The OLRRE is an exercise coordinated by TBS whereby some 180 federal institutions reapply the regulations to update the linguistic designation of some 10,000 federal offices located in Quebec and across Canada.

This reapplication of the regulations is based on data from the 2021 census.

Thanks to the amended regulations, more Canadians will be able to obtain federal services in French across the country.

In accordance with Treasury Board policies, in a bilingual Quebec office such as a post office, staff must greet and communicate with customers in French first.

I will stop here. My colleague and I will be glad to answer any questions you may have.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thank you very much, Mr. Quell.

Mr. Godin, welcome back to OGGO. The floor is yours for six minutes, please.

[Joël Godin, Conservative, Portneuf—Jacques-Cartier, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I thank the witnesses for joining us and taking part in this exercise.

The situation in Quebec is unique, since it's the only province where French is the first language and the common language.

Unexpectedly, following the 2021 census, Canada Post undertook consultations. I remember the 2021 census included an enumeration. Unfortunately, we'll never have that opportunity again because the government did not want to include a similar provision in the Official Languages Act. That situation led Canada Post to decide to poll its customers.

I'd like to know what takes priority, but I don't know to whom I should put my question. Should I ask the Heritage Canada representative, even though she said in her opening remarks that it's not part of her mandate? Should I ask, instead, the people from the Treasury Board Secretariat, or the people responsible for procurement? I'd like someone to enlighten me.

Once again, unfortunately the new Official Languages Act does not clearly define who is responsible for its application. We, on this side, asked that Treasury Board be the one to oversee the application of the Official Languages Act.

Mr. Quell, we met during our study on modernizing the Official Languages Act, so I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.

[Carsten Quell]

Canada Post follows the process set out in the regulations. In other words, based on new demographic data in the 2021 census, we determined the number of individuals likely to want service in a minority official language. I'm choosing my words carefully, it's a new method of calculating. This new calculation method—