Government Operations Committee on Dec. 5th, 2024

[An hon. member]

[Inaudible—Editor]

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

I know, but it's just more procedural games.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Are we in agreement, then?

(Motion agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

Wonderful.

Before we adjourn, Mr. Sergerie has now tried twice to appear. He has offered or intimated that he'd like to perhaps try to appear in person. The other two, Mr. Irngaut and his associate, have said they'll appear in person.

Colleagues, you'll also be getting what I think is a rather disturbing letter at about three o'clock today—it's just being translated—from a whistle-blower on the situation. They are asking to appear as well. I know that we're at the end of our procurement study, but I think once you read the letter, you'll agree with me. I think we can probably squeeze in maybe two hours at the end of the session to try to accommodate Mr. Irngaut.

I'll wait for you to read the whistle-blower letter. He's asking to appear. I'm hoping that we can squeeze in a couple hours for Mr. Irngaut and the whistle-blower by the 17th. I can probably squeeze it in.

[Charles Sousa, Liberal, Mississauga—Lakeshore, ON]

Let us read it first. Then we'll determine that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Okay.

What about the request from Mr. Sergerie and Mr. Irngaut to come back in person?

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

[Technical difficulty—Editor] help us with any outstanding area in the report or recommendations?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm not sure what Mr. Irngaut had to say.

Go ahead.

[Kelly Block, Conservative, Carlton Trail—Eagle Creek, SK]

I would suggest that because the issues were technical difficulties on our end, we should actually make time. We should make every effort to hear from them. We invite them. We can't accommodate them. We go ahead with the meeting.

I think it behooves us to try to find a way to hear from them.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Yes. I'm not talking about adding a day. I think I can probably squeeze it in.

Ms. Gill, go ahead.

[Marilène Gill, Bloc, Manicouagan, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to say two things.

First, the interpreter indicated that she couldn't hear what Mr. Jowhari was saying. He may not have been speaking into his microphone, or it may have been on mute.

Second, I'm going to say more or less the same thing as Mrs. Block. Many times, the Standing Committee on Indigenous and Northern Affairs hasn't been able to hear from witnesses in northern communities. I know that in this case, Mr. Sergerie is in Wendake. That said, I am always complaining about how poor the Internet networks are in certain places and how witnesses aren't able to come all the way here to meet with the committee. Some people I know have to spend a week travelling to get to Ottawa, and I wouldn't want them to be penalized because of where they live or because the network prevents them from testifying.

I know some witnesses have testified by telephone in the past. There was a time in 2018 when someone from my riding couldn't appear before the committee in person but was able to testify another way. We need to figure out how we can accommodate those witnesses. There are ways to prevent identity fraud and make sure that people are who they say they are. Then, we would have access to their testimony. It's a difficult situation because sometimes we have to postpone meeting with them two or three times in a row. In some cases, we're never able to make it work. Perhaps it's time to deal with the source of the problem and find other ways for these people to appear, so that they aren't penalized and so that they can participate fully in the committee's proceedings.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Ms. Idlout, did you have your hand up as well? Please go ahead.

[Lori Idlout, NDP, Nunavut, NU]

Thank you.

I asked the president of ITK, with his experience at NTI, a few questions regarding indigenous procurement and the Nunavut agreement, but he wasn't able to answer my questions directly. It would be great to have Mr. Irngaut appear, especially if he's asking to. I would support squeezing him in, if possible.

As well, could you respond to us on what we'll be doing at next week's meeting?

Qujannamiik.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Yes. We have Minister Duclos on the Thursday. The second hour can be with the officials, depending on the committee. We've already passed the estimates in the committee, but often the minister comes after the fact just because of timing. We have the minister, and then the second hour can be with officials or with the people we've missed.

At Tuesday's meeting we will have the procurement ombud. We can do one hour with him and one hour squeezing in the witnesses we've missed, and then perhaps one for the whistle-blower's letter, or we'll just do the whole two hours with the ombud.

I don't think there's a lot in the supplementaries for PSPC and the minister. Well, they'll be with the minister anyway.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Mr. Chair, can we also ask the witnesses, just in case there's a repeat of technical issues, to submit their briefs as well?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

They're offering to attend in person.

[An hon. member]

They're coming in person. That's what we're doing.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Oh, I see. Pardon me. I had misunderstood that. Okay.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Perfect. I'm not keen on Mr. Sergerie trying it a third time. He kind of intimated that he'd like to attend in person.

[An hon. member]

That's fair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Wonderful.

We're out of time anyway. Thanks, everyone, for agreement. The clerk will update you.

Thank you to everyone who jumped in and filled in for others because of our IT issues. I really appreciate it.

We're adjourned.