Government Operations Committee on Feb. 6th, 2023

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Okay. Was there any discussion around those contracts, aside from, as you call it, “administration and evaluation”?

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

Certainly not with me. Obviously I'm fairly new to this post, but in the way the process exists, there would be no contact with the minister's office or with the minister's political staff.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Okay.

Was there anyone in the department, Mr. Thompson?

[Paul Thompson]

As Ms. Royds indicated earlier, there are different levels of delegation for the approvals. Depending on the value, it would be done by different levels of officials. Some of them—

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

Thank you—

[Paul Thompson]

—would be done at the ministerial level, and some have to go to Treasury Board for approval. There are different levels of authority.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Someone pre-empted me in thanking you for your time, Mr. Jowhari.

Ms. Vignola, you have six minutes, please.

[Bryan May, Liberal, Cambridge, ON]

I apologize, Mr. Chair.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Good afternoon, Minister Jaczek, Mr. Thompson and Ms. Royds.

I'll continue along the same lines as my colleague Mr. Jowhari.

In the past 12 months, have you, anyone in your office or any senior official had a face-to-face or telephone meeting with anyone from McKinsey?

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

Absolutely not.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

All right. So no one—

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

Excuse me; Mr. Thompson has something to say.

[Paul Thompson]

I'd like to add a clarification. McKinsey provides services to government departments. All of our team members and I regularly work with the team contracted to provide consulting services regarding payroll administration. So we have a relationship under that contract.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

When you need to communicate with these McKinsey individuals working under contract with Parliament, do they use an email address that is directly linked to their original employer, McKinsey, or is a special email address created for them within the parliamentary structure?

[Paul Thompson]

All relationships fall within the structure of the contract. So communication is limited to the aspects of work that are described in the contract. That is how it's structured.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Does it say in the contract that individuals who will be working for the Government of Canada on behalf of McKinsey will have an email address that ends in “parl.gc.ca” or “gc.ca”?

[Paul Thompson]

As far as I know, email addresses that end in “gc.ca” are for public servants, and those of employees of outside firms are their own responsibility.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Okay. Therefore, you don't believe it's possible to confuse a public servant with a consultant.

[Paul Thompson]

I'm not aware of any such case.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you.

To your knowledge, over the past 12 months, has McKinsey & Company been registered in the Registry of Lobbyists?

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

I understand just from media that I've been reading that apparently McKinsey has not registered as a lobbyist.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

If the firm is not registered as a lobbyist, normally it cannot request any meetings. However, a government department may request a meeting with McKinsey, in which case it would not necessarily be considered a lobbyist.

Is that correct?

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

I cannot imagine a circumstance such as you described.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

All right, thank you.

The 2022–23 federal contract data suggest that McKinsey had exclusive rights to at least four bid solicitations that were awarded in a non-competitive way. All of Canada's free trade agreements allow limited bidding on the basis of exclusive rights, but what is the basis for McKinsey having exclusive rights to certain bid solicitations?