Government Operations Committee on Oct. 31st, 2023

[Colin Wood]

It's approximately 99%.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Is it all federal? Do you have, for example, contracts with provincial governments, or are they 99% federal contracts?

[Colin Wood]

Our expertise is around working with the federal government.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Dalian and Coradix found themselves at the centre of this storm. There are accusations of fraud, for example, and misconduct that are being levelled.

Looking back, what would you do differently?

[Colin Wood]

I understand.

In this case, the optics were brought forward because of these CVs. Like I mentioned earlier, we're extremely disappointed that this has happened, and we are making changes to our quality management system. We are going to review more closely our arrangements with third parties and the consultants who are provided to us. I think, as a starting point, that attestations from not only the subcontractors but the subcontractors' consultants will be a requirement of any task authorization for us going forward.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

You guys have been around for 30 years. Do you see the inflating of numbers to score higher points to get contracts? Does that happen? How frequently does that happen?

[Colin Wood]

I'm not entirely sure. Could you be...? Is it with respect to an RFP or a particular contract?

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

For example, in this instance, there are accusations and evidence that numbers were being inflated for the experience of a certain subcontractor. Is that typical in federal contracting where, again, experience numbers are inflated in order to be able to get the contract? Do you see that? How endemic is that issue? How frequent is that issue in your experience?

[Colin Wood]

It is not a normal practice. Unfortunately, the administrative errors on those CVs were a mistake.

As for billing rates and contracting rates in the federal government, it's a highly competitive business. There are over 300 companies, and most of the RFPs that we respond to are a combination of financial and technical scores. This does nothing but drive rates down to extremely competitive levels. All of the rates that we use are consistent with market rates in the IT industry.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Let's talk about ArriveCAN, since we are doing an ArriveCAN study. You guys have a piece of the puzzle that you designed over some time. The ArriveCAN app was used by 60 million travellers to cross safely across the border. When we talk about travellers, we're also, I imagine, talking about people who are bringing across medicine, food and other important supplies, making sure that, in that national emergency, we had a clear flow of traffic. That was something that was absolutely critical.

The Conservatives state that, had they been responsible during this pandemic, they would have designed an ArriveCAN app that cost $200,000 and delivered that for Canadians during our national health emergency. Can you tell us what the Conservatives would have delivered to Canadians for $200,000?

[Colin Wood]

Mr. Chair, for the member, I can't speak to what could have been delivered for $250,000. I can only comment on what our contributions were in the task authorizations we received from CBSA.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Again, you guys are IT specialists, and you've been working on projects for 30 years. There is a cost that was obviously attached to ArriveCAN. Can you tell us why an ArriveCAN cost $54 million? Can you speak to that?

[Colin Wood]

I can—

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Briefly, Mr. Wood....

[Colin Wood]

Yes, certainly.

I can give you my opinions on that. Again, we worked on only parts of ArriveCAN. We delivered the work we were asked to by clients on our contracts.

The ArriveCAN app is not an app that people use. It's not Candy Crush, and they weren't ordering pizza with this. It needed to interface with a number of complex and highly secure systems, including border security and passports. Moreover, this app needed to ensure that Canadians' passports and health information were fully secure and protected.

Remember, too, we needed to remember that this application was being built during the pandemic. People were getting sick. They were needing to isolate. People were dying. There were lockdowns. There were travel restrictions. This is not a $250,000 endeavour. We were dealing with citizens' private information.

With all this going on, the Government of Canada was building an application for Canadians to upload their most personal and sensitive information to help slow or stop the spread of COVID in our country.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm going to have to cut you off there, Mr. Wood. We're going to move on, but perhaps you can get back in another round.

Ms. Vignola, you have two and a half minutes, please.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Wood, what is CORADIX's address in Toronto?

[Colin Wood]

Mr. Yeo is more appropriate to answer.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I didn't ask for Dalian's address. I asked for CORADIX's address.

[David Yeo]

Yes, we are in the process of trying to expand.

We've done very well in the NCR area and through what we call Coradix Technology—

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I asked for CORADIX's mailing address in Toronto. I'm not interested in your expansion plans. I'm interested in CORADIX's address in Toronto.

I'm going to tell you what it is, Mr. Wood. Your website lists the address as 609 Bloor St. West, Toronto. Apparently, you're in the same building as a barbershop—

[Colin Wood]

That's a partner that—

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

—and a store called Tibetan Paper & Handicraft. There's something else on the second floor. CORADIX, however, is nowhere in the building.

[Colin Wood]

That's a fully functioning office. We sometimes partner with a company called CorGTA.

[Julie Vignola, Bloc, Beauport—Limoilou, QC]

I see.