Health Committee on April 15th, 2020

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 13 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Health. Pursuant to the order of reference of Tuesday, March 24, and Saturday, April 11, the committee is meeting for the purpose of receiving evidence concerning matters related to the government's response to the COVID-19 pandemic.

Today's meeting is taking place entirely by video conference, and the proceedings will be made available via the House of Commons website.

As at the last meeting, the webcast will always show the person speaking rather than the entirety of the committee.

In order to facilitate the work of our interpreters and ensure an orderly meeting, I would like to outline a few rules to be followed.

Interpretation in this video conference will work very much as it does in a regular committee meeting. You have the choice at the bottom of your screen of either “Floor”, “English” or “French”. When I say the “bottom of the screen”, that's for those using a PC computer. For people using an iPad or something else, your experience will vary slightly.

Before speaking, please wait until I recognize you by name. When you are ready to speak, you can either click on the microphone icon to activate your microphone or you can hold down your space bar while you are speaking. When you release the space bar, your microphone will mute itself.

I remind everyone that all comments by members and witnesses should be addressed through the chair. Should members need to address the floor outside of their designated time for questions, they should activate their microphone and state that they have a point of order.

If a member wishes to intervene on a point of order that has been raised by another member, they should use the “raised hand” function. This will signal to the chair that you are interested in speaking. In order to do so, you should click on "participants" at the bottom of the screen, and when the list pops up, you will see next to your name that you can click “raise hand”.

When speaking, speak slowly and clearly, and when you are not speaking, your microphone should be on mute. The use of headsets is strongly encouraged. If you have a microphone on your headset that hangs down, please make sure it is not rubbing on your shirt during your questioning time.

Should any technical challenges arise—for example, in relation to interpretation or if you are accidentally disconnected—please advise the chair or clerk immediately, and the technical team will work to resolve that. Please note that we may need to suspend during these times, as we need to ensure that all members are able to participate fully.

Before we get started, can everyone click on the screen in the top right-hand corner if you're on a PC and ensure you are on "gallery view"? With this view, you should be able to see all the participants on a grid view, and it will ensure that all video participants can see one another.

During this meeting we will follow the same rules that usually apply to opening statements and the questioning of witnesses during our regular meetings. Each witness will have 10 minutes for an opening statement, followed by the usual rounds of questions by members.

I would like to now welcome our witnesses. As an individual, we have Dr. Joanne Liu—

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Mr. Chair, before we get going, I want to dispense with a motion relating to the business at hand, but before I do, I want to seek clarification from you and the clerk. I'll raise a couple of sentences here from page 980 of Bosc and Gagnon, where this is stated:

Standing committees often need the collaboration, expertise and knowledge of a variety of individuals to assist them in their studies and investigations. Usually these persons appear willingly before committees when invited to do so. But situations may arise where an individual does not agree to appear and give evidence. If the committee considers that this evidence is essential to its study, it has the power to summon such a person to appear.

I have a question for you and the clerk. Does this committee have the power to summon witnesses, or merely to request?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

In general, the committee would have that power. However, we are operating under restricted authorization from the House at this point.

At this point, paragraph (n) of the unanimous consent motion that was passed on Saturday says this:

(n) in addition to receiving evidence, the committees enumerated in paragraphs (l) and (m) of this order, while meeting by videoconference or teleconference, may also consider motions requesting or scheduling specific witnesses and these motions shall be decided by way of a recorded vote.

My first thought about this is that issuing a summons does not fit in that category. I would like to take that under advisement, and maybe we could discuss it during the meeting of our subcommittee members tomorrow.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

I appreciate that bit of clarification. This committee, then, essentially does not have all the regular powers and privileges that it would normally have when we're meeting in person, so this virtual committee is a poor substitute for the real thing.

In that case I would like to move a motion that the committee invite Dr. Aylward, Canadian adviser to the WHO, to appear before the Standing Committee on Health for one hour, no later than May 1, 2020.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Very well. The motion is in order.

We had a discussion. I thought we were going to deal with this sort of thing during the subcommittee meetings, but you have made—

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

With all due respect, Mr. Chair, that was before Dr. Aylward had cancelled on the meeting, so I think this is a unique circumstance, and whether or not he should come is certainly worthy of a vote with the committee.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Well, as I said, the motion is in order. You can move it and you have moved it.

Is there any discussion on this motion?

[Marcus Powlowski, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Rainy River, ON]

Matt, as moved, you're asking him; you're not summoning him at the moment, right?

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

That's right, Marcus. The Chair just gave the explanation that we can't summon him at this time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Are there any other interventions?

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

I am happy to proceed with the vote, and I understand it will be a recorded vote. If not, I would make that request.

I just want to state for the record that I am not in agreement that the committee cannot summons, based on what you read out. I understand that's not the motion before us today, but I don't want it to be taken that our voting on this is a concession that the committee can't issue a summons, because it is my position that we can do so by the terms of the unanimous consent motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

This is simply a vote on the motion as moved. It has no implications on any other matter.

Is there any other discussion?

[Luc Thériault, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Can you read the motion, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Monsieur Thériault, did you wish to intervene?

[Luc Thériault, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Chair, I was asking for the motion to be read again.

Furthermore, since we've taken the trouble to bring in witnesses, I was wondering whether this discussion could be held in the subcommittee.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Mr. Chair, I'm sorry, but I didn't get any translation. I am on the proper setting, but I didn't hear any translation.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Mr. Thériault has just advised that he thinks this could be done in the subcommittee, given that we have witnesses, and he didn't hear the motion.

I'm going to ask Mr. Jeneroux to reread the motion, please.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I move that the committee invite Dr. Aylward, Canadian adviser to the WHO, to appear before the Standing Committee on Health for one hour, no later than May 1, 2020.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Monsieur Thériault, is that okay with you? Have you heard the motion this time?

Are there any further interventions on this question?

Seeing none, I shall ask the clerk to undertake a voice vote. Go ahead, Madame Clerk.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Ms. Erica Pereira]

The vote is on the motion of Monsieur Jeneroux. I apologize, but I do not have your names in alphabetical order in front of me, so please listen carefully for your name. If you are in favour, say “yea”; if you are opposed, say “nay”.

(Motion agreed to: yeas 10; nays 0) [See Minutes of Proceedings]

[An hon. member]

I have a point of order. Does Mr. Van Bynen get to vote?

[The Clerk]

Oh, my apologies.

Mr. Van Bynen.

[Tony Van Bynen, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Yea.

[The Clerk]

The motion is carried.

[Marcus Powlowski, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Rainy River, ON]

Hold on. I didn't get to vote, but I vote yes.