Health Committee on July 13th, 2020

[Darren Fisher, Liberal, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

Again, knowing full well that Dr. Kitchen can move a subamendment, I will stick with 2010.

I've used the argument—and I believe in that argument—about putting our public servants to too much effort. I've questioned numerous times whether I would actually do the 2010 date, but I do think that when it comes to the national emergency stockpile, going back to when that product was considered new is what I would like to do.

Again, Dr. Kitchen has the ability to move a subamendment, but I'll support the 2010 date.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Thank you, Mr. Fisher.

There will not be unanimous consent here.

Dr. Kitchen, if you wish to move the motion, please feel free to do so at this time.

[Robert Gordon Kitchen, Conservative, Souris—Moose Mountain, SK]

I'd like to move a subamendment to change the date to 2005, please.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

All right. We have a subamendment to Mr. Fisher's amendment. Mr. Fisher's amendment was to move the date in relation to the national stockpile to 2010, and Mr. Kitchen has modified that to 2005.

Is there any debate on Dr. Kitchen's subamendment?

I'm not seeing anybody's hand go up. Seeing none, I'll call the vote on that.

(Subamendment agreed to: yeas 6; nays 5 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Mr. Fisher's amendment as further amended is that we take a look at 2005 as a start date for examining the documents from the national stockpile.

Are we clear on the amendment? The motion before us at this point is Mr. Fisher's amendment as amended by Dr. Kitchen.

I see Mr. Kelloway has his hand up.

Mr. Kelloway, please go ahead.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

Thanks, Mr. Chair.

In relation to the dates that we passed here, September 8 or September 7, if we do this, I think we're going to have to push the date back a bit in terms of the ability of staff to pull the information together.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Thank you, Mr. Kelloway.

That amendment, if that's an amendment, would not be in order at this moment. We're dealing with a different matter entirely. I'll have to ask the clerk if it would be in order later, since we've already dealt with the dates and times.

Continuing debate on Mr. Fisher's amendment as amended by Dr. Kitchen, I see we have Ms. Sidhu.

Go ahead.

[Sonia Sidhu, Liberal, Brampton South, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I wanted to raise my hand about the date, so I'll pass. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Okay, thank you.

Is there any further debate on Mr. Fisher's amendment as further amended by Dr. Kitchen?

Seeing none, I will call the question.

(Amendment as amended agreed to: yeas 11; nays 0 [ See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

We're back on the main question, the motion of Mr. Jeneroux, as subsequently amended several times. Is there any debate on this main motion?

Dr. Jaczek, please go ahead.

[Helena Jaczek, Liberal, Markham—Stouffville, ON]

As a number of my colleagues have mentioned, given the very large number of documents, no doubt, that will be generated by the amendment we just voted on, taking us back to 2003, I would like to propose another amendment to the date of the production of the documents. Now I believe the documents are to be provided by August 31, and to be published on the committee's website by September 7. I'm wondering if we could add a little more time. I'd like to amend the motion to have the documents provided by September 30, and published a week later, which I presume would be sometime like October 7.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Thank you, Dr. Jaczek.

I have a note from the clerk. It says that because we changed the scope of the motion, it would be appropriate to revisit the date. Therefore, Dr. Jaczek, your motion to amend is in order.

We have Mr. Kelloway. Please go ahead.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

MP Jaczek took the words right out of my mouth. I believe that 15 years of documents and whatnot will require the amount of time MP Jaczek has put forward, so I'll be supporting that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Thank you, Mr. Kelloway.

Mr. Jeneroux, please go ahead.

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

I believe you set a precedent for accepting a friendly amendment just moments ago, Mr. Chair. If you're still in the mood to accept these types of amendments, I would certainly be open to amending that to account for the large scope of time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Mr. Jeneroux, are you proposing that we vote by unanimous consent to change the dates as Dr. Jaczek has proposed?

[Matt Jeneroux, Conservative, Edmonton Riverbend, AB]

I don't know if that's my call, Mr. Chair, but if it is, then sure, I'll propose it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

If we can do it by unanimous consent, I'm happy to do so.

Is there any dissent from accepting Dr. Jaczek's proposal to change the dates?

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Mr. Chair, I wonder if I may speak to that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Certainly, Ms. Kwan. Go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you.

I'm just wondering if this would make sense. I'd like to try this on for size. We've already moved our original date to the end of August. Now we're talking about the end of September. I understand that the scope of the information has been broadened.

How about if we do this? For the latter part of the information that's being sought, the scope of the information that's been broadened, we extend the date for that information to be made available with a timeline of September. For the original part of the information that was being sought by the committee, we still abide by the August 31 timeline. We're applying two timelines to the information: the original information that's being sought, and for that to be made available by August 31, and September 7 or 8, I think, for it to be published; and then for this second part, where the scope of the information being sought has been expanded, for that information to be made available by the end of September.

Mr. Chair, can I try this on for size, so we can maybe get the documents in batches?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

Sure, let us take the temperature of the room here and see if there's any will to proceed in this manner.

Is the committee prepared to accept Ms. Kwan's proposal to amend the motion to provide the documents in two stages, the second one being for the national stockpile to correspond to Dr. Jaczek's dates and the other documents to be, as previously decided, August 31 and September 7?

Can I have some indication from anybody if they oppose such a perspective?

[Tony Van Bynen, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

Mr. Chair, could I just clarify if you're referring to the documents that relate to the period of 2005 to 2020? What I wouldn't want to see is the information relative to the national emergency strategic stockpile first arrive in a bundle for 2015 to 2020. I think all of the documents that relate to that subject should arrive at the same time. Could I just get that clarified?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ron McKinnon]

I believe that is Ms. Kwan's suggestion.

[Tony Van Bynen, Liberal, Newmarket—Aurora, ON]

I just wanted to confirm that all of the documents, not just a portion of the documents, for the national emergency strategic stockpile would be published early, that all of them would be reviewed and that our recommendations will be based on all of the information and not partial information.