Evidence of meeting #32 for Health in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was pandemic.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Tony Van Bynen Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
I know that you run three programs: Leeder Place, Porter Place and the youth shelter.
Could you elaborate on those three programs and how you might have had to change the provision of services specific to those programs? How have each of these groups been impacted by the pandemic?
Chief Executive Officer, Blue Door Support Services
Sure.
We run our youth emergency housing, Kevin's Place, which is in Newmarket. It's in a house. We actually couldn't run that safely at first, because there were shared accommodations—all shared common spaces. We had to move the youth in with men at Porter Place, our men's emergency housing program, which was not ideal. There's a reason we separate them. They have different needs. That one was shut down for a while. It's now back operating but at a smaller scale.
For our families, we worked with the region. We used our family site as the isolation site for the entire region, so for the nine municipalities, that served as the isolation site. Our families moved to a hotel for about eight months or so, and then we moved them back to the site. We've had to cut down a little bit to allow for spacing there. They can't use the common rooms, and the kids can't play together, which is tough. That's been fairly tough.
What's happened is that everyone in York region goes through a transitional site first for 14 days. Usually they would just enter into whichever site made sense for them. Now they go through the transitional site. The clients we're seeing in all of our programs are the hardest to house. With the easier people to house, who might need a little income support or just help in finding a home, that happens in the first 14 days at the transitional site.
What Blue Door and others are seeing when they see those clients, or what we call high-acuity people with higher needs—larger families, not employed, more severe addictions, mental health challenges—who are harder to house, with the number of people we're housing.... It's hard to see places too, because they're only doing virtual open houses, if at all. It's become quite a challenge to get these individuals and families housed.
Liberal
Tony Van Bynen Liberal Newmarket—Aurora, ON
Thank you.
You're doing a great job, Michael, and I appreciate the way you're working in our community.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ron McKinnon
Thank you, Mr. Van Bynen.
Mr. Thériault, you have the floor for six minutes.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
Let me thank all the witnesses for their testimony. It helps us understand the collateral damage of the pandemic. I'm going to start with Dr. Perrault.
Dr. Perrault, I want to thank you for taking the time to meet with us. You practice emergency medicine, so we have a lot to gain from your being here. I would also like to thank you for the quality of your testimony, which was surgically precise, if I may say so. You summed up the situation in such a clear way that sent chills down my spine. Your voice joins those of Dr. Bélanger from the Association des gastro-entérologues du Québec, Dr. Champagne from the Association des médecins hématologues et oncologues du Québec, representatives from the Canadian Cancer Society and Dr. Shabah from the Canadian Medical Association.
First, you say that you are trying to keep the percentage of patients outside of acceptable delays at around 10%, but that the percentage has gone up to 45%. It's like playing Russian roulette, and the stake is sudden death.
Can you explain this further?
The experts who appeared before the committee in the first wave of the pandemic told us that the health care system was already weakened by chronic underfunding over the last 30 years. No one could say how the situation was going to change. That was during the first wave. Now we are dealing with the third wave.
Are you worried?
Cardiac Surgeon, Montreal Heart Institute, and President, Association des chirurgiens cardiovasculaires et thoraciques du Québec
I hope I've made that point clearly: the COVID-19 pandemic has caused the shutdown or lack of access to the health care system. The more waves—and the longer the pandemic continues—the more long-term the consequences will be.
Catching up on necessary procedures may take several years if funds are not urgently provided. Some provinces are talking about a catch-up period of two and a half years. In Quebec, the backlog of procedures is estimated at more than 100,000. There will be long-term consequences before we can catch up with any success.
In addition, the delay in testing and the lack of accessibility means that there will be consequences not for two or three years, but for several more. Sporadic funding will not help us make a difference in the long term.
This image may be a little strong, but we risk sacrificing a generation or having problems for years to come if we do not react quickly to the current situation. As for the aftermath of the COVID-19 pandemic, no one knows exactly when it will end or if it will end. We must keep that in mind.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
Just like in oncology, skyrocketing costs are expected in cardiovascular surgery and cardiology if we are not able to do something about prevention first. If we are not able to act early, we must certainly expect increasing and skyrocketing costs, not to mention the consequences on patients.
Is that what we need to understand?
Cardiac Surgeon, Montreal Heart Institute, and President, Association des chirurgiens cardiovasculaires et thoraciques du Québec
Absolutely.
Let me make another point. We sometimes think of cardiovascular patients as being retired or not working. Many of our patients, especially with the increase in risk factors, such as obesity, are young and of working age. If these people are not seen in time, and if we can't get them back to an optimal functional level, they will become dependent, which will affect their quality of life. Therefore, more resources are needed. If the opportunity is lost, there will be consequences not only for the people affected, but for the system.
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
In addition, we have not yet addressed the waiting lists in orthopedics, which also have an impact on people's cardiovascular health in the medium term. The longer the wait for patients who have difficulty moving, walking or being active, the more likely their need to see you.
Dr. Perrault, the government is currently telling us, in the midst of a pandemic, that it will take care of COVID-19 patients first. It is telling us that it is injecting money on an ad hoc basis and that it will inject substantial, predictable, recurrent and long-term funding into health transfers only after the pandemic.
Do you see this as a medically defensible decision?
Cardiac Surgeon, Montreal Heart Institute, and President, Association des chirurgiens cardiovasculaires et thoraciques du Québec
I think it's risky and misses the point. We already know what the consequences will be for patients who do not have COVID-19 if we do nothing for this majority. I hope I have described them well in my statement.
There are many COVID-19 patients, but they are still a minority compared to all the other patients who suffer from cancers and cardiovascular diseases, among others. We are putting all the money in one place. Although there is a need to invest for COVID-19 patients, this strategy lacks vision.
I don't think we can wait. We can't predict exactly when the pandemic situation will be resolved. Every day that goes by without investments for patients who don't have COVID-19 is a missed opportunity, thereby leading to the long-term consequences that we can easily predict.
Cardiac Surgeon, Montreal Heart Institute, and President, Association des chirurgiens cardiovasculaires et thoraciques du Québec
You are welcome.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ron McKinnon
Thank you, Mr. Thériault.
We'll now go to Mr. Davies.
Mr. Davies, please go ahead, for six minutes.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to our witnesses for their testimony.
Mr. Braithwaite, you mentioned that the definition of “affordability” is 80% of market. Whose definition is that?
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
The federal government defines affordability in Canada as 80% of market. I take it that you think that's too high, that it's an inappropriate measure.
Chief Executive Officer, Blue Door Support Services
Absolutely. For the average room in larger Canadian cities, a room in a house will be $700 to $900. If affordable is 80% of, say, $2,000 for a one-bedroom apartment.... Some people who are receiving government assistance have an income of $700 total in a month. There's a huge gap there.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
If you know, approximately how many homeless people are there in Canada today?
Chief Executive Officer, Blue Door Support Services
Approximately 235,000 people will experience homelessness on any given night.
NDP
Chief Executive Officer, Blue Door Support Services
Unfortunately that number has continued to climb.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
Ms. Choo, you mentioned intersectionality in racism. I'm wondering if you could explain this to us further. What have been the effects of the increase in anti-Asian racism, from a gendered point of view, men to women? I'm also interested in how that's impacted Asian youth.
Chief Executive Officer, S.U.C.C.E.S.S.
Certainly racism in all its forms, especially anti-Asian racism, has been hitting a peak and is going to climb during COVID and also beyond COVID, unfortunately. It's not just about people of colour, though. It's also about looking at people who are xenophobic, classist and misogynistic, and at all other forms of oppression, definitely.
This impacts people's health and wellness, and instills fear among us in the communities. We know this is not a value in Canada, especially regarding newcomers. They come to Canada hoping for a new life and hoping for a welcoming country to settle in. However, this is not the case.
This is a real fear and a real problem that we need to deal with, and it is not something we can just ignore.
NDP
Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC
Ms. Choo, can you outline any barriers that immigrants or newcomers to Canada have been facing when accessing health care related to COVID-19, such as testing, treatment or vaccination?
Chief Executive Officer, S.U.C.C.E.S.S.
Absolutely.
Certainly, when we're facing the COVID-19 pandemic situation, it affects all of us, including newcomers in Canada.
They've been facing a lot of settlement and cultural barriers, let alone that they have to think about their safety and the concern about COVID's spread. How are they going to access the testing? How are they going to navigate online? Many of them may not have the technical skills nor even the Internet, with the affordability of Internet nowadays. It is very important to look at all those barriers in order to support those newcomers, especially refugees.
It is crucial to make sure everybody understands that it is important for all of us to play an important part so that COVID-19 will be eradicated. We are hoping to support those most vulnerable people as well when they're facing financial hardships, cultural differences and language barriers.