Health Committee on June 15th, 2022

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 27 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Health.

Today's meeting is televised. We're going to meet until seven o'clock or a motion for adjournment, whichever comes earlier.

We have the minister until 6:30 p.m., so for one hour.

Today's meeting is a briefing on mental health and addictions in Canada, with Minister Bennett and senior officials.

The meeting is taking place in a hybrid format pursuant to the House order of November 25, 2021.

Per the directive of the Board of Internal Economy of March 10, 2022, all those attending in person must wear a mask, except for members who are at their place during proceedings. In accordance with our routine motion, I'm informing the committee that all witnesses have completed the required connection tests in advance.

We will now welcome the witnesses who are with us this afternoon and who have been patiently waiting.

We have the honourable Carolyn Bennett, Minister of Mental Health and Addictions. From the Canadian Institutes of Health Research, we have Dr. Michael J. Strong, president. From the Department of Health, we have with us, in the room, Heather Jeffrey, associate deputy minister. Online, we have Jocelyne Voisin, assistant deputy minister, strategic policy branch; Eric Bélair, associate assistant deputy minister, strategic policy branch; Kendal Weber, assistant deputy minister, controlled substances and cannabis branch; and Jennifer Saxe, director general, controlled substances directorate, controlled substances and cannabis branch. Finally, from the Public Health Agency of Canada, we have Candice St-Aubin, vice-president, health promotion and chronic disease prevention branch.

Thank you to all of you for hanging around to inform us, and to wait out the votes.

I understand it's just the minister providing an opening statement this afternoon.

Minister Bennett, welcome to the committee. You have the floor.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Minister of Mental Health and Addictions and Associate Minister of Health]

Mr. Chair, thank you for the opportunity to appear before the committee today to discuss my mandate and priorities.

I would like to begin by acknowledging that I am speaking to you today from the unceded traditional territory of the Algonquin Anishinaabeg people.

I'm excited to have the whole team of public servants during National Public Service Week. They are the wind beneath our wings, and we're very, very grateful.

As most of you know, the core of my mandate is to ensure that mental health care is treated as a full and equal part of our universal health care system. There can be no health without mental health.

Since 2015, we've made historic investments to support the mental health of Canadians, including $5 billion to the provinces and territories to increase the availability of mental health care, $598 million for a distinctions-based mental health and wellness strategy for indigenous peoples, $140 million to support veterans, $45 million for national mental health care standards, and $270 million for the Wellness Together portal.

Through the $5-billion bilateral agreements with the provinces and territories alone, our government will provide them with an additional $600 million of funding on an annual basis to support mental health care, from now until 2027.

We want to reassure the committee that we're still fully committed to the additional $4.5 billion over five years promised in the 2021 platform for the new ongoing, permanent Canada mental health transfer.

What we heard from early engagements with partners and community-based organizations, while providing these vital mental health services on the ground, is that a new permanent transfer had to be built on appropriate transparency and accountability.

We are engaging with the provinces and territories to inform the design of the new Canada mental health transfer as well as a comprehensive evidence-based plan, including the sharing of indicators and outcomes.

We are working towards national standards for mental health and addictions support so Canadians know what they should be able to expect in terms of timeliness and quality services, treatment, and support.

Last March we announced a partnership with the Standards Council of Canada—who demonstrated expertise in national standardization initiatives—to develop national standards for delivering mental health and substance use services.

While the COVID-19 pandemic has exacerbated the gaps in mental health supports available to Canadians, it also accelerated the use of virtual care options to expand the availability and flexibility of those services.

As I think we discussed last time, the Wellness Together Canada online portal service provides free 24-7 mental health and addiction services and resources to people in need across Canada, including one-on-one counselling. The new companion app, called “PocketWell”, will ensure that Canadians have access to the mental health and substance use services they need, no matter where they live.

The overdose and toxic drug supply crisis has taken a tragic toll on the families, loved ones and communities of those we have lost across Canada. Since 2020, our government has invested $282 million in the substance use and addictions program, which includes the $100 million that was in budget 2022.

Evidence shows that harm reduction measures save lives, and we have invested over $64 million specifically to expand access to a safer supply of pharmaceutical-grade drugs and to life-saving naloxone across the country.

Substance use is a health issue. We are working to divert people who use drugs away from the criminal justice system to access adequate supportive health and social services and build those truly important trusted relationships.

We recently approved B.C.'s application to allow personal possession of small amounts of certain illegal drugs, which included a comprehensive implementation and evaluation plan. This proposal addressed the public health and public safety impacts of this request, has the support of key law enforcement and will inform other jurisdictions as to any potential future national approach.

Thank you for the opportunity to highlight some of the key aspects of my mandate. I really look forward to expanding on my brief remarks through your thoughtful questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you very much, Minister.

We're going to begin with those questions now, starting with the Conservatives.

Mr. Lake, you have six minutes.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, Minister.

I just want to be absolutely clear that I'm not going to ask you about funding in the past for mental health related to previous spending, because I know that when I ask these questions, that tends to be where you go.

I'm going to ask about page 75 of the Liberal platform, which I'm looking at right now. The new investment promised on page 75 of the Liberal platform is under “Canada Mental Health Transfer” at $250 million for 2021-22.

Could you please tell the committee how much the government actually spent in 2021-22 for the Canada mental health transfer specifically?

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

I think, Mike, as I said in my remarks, that what has happened is that in the bilateral agreements with the provinces, there was a commitment. In 2021, there was an actual total of $600 million in new money and another $600 million coming up, such that we are in 2021-22, and that will be ongoing until 2027—600 million new dollars every year.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

Is it accurate to say that there was no money spent specifically for the Canada mental health transfer in budget year 2021-22, yes or no?

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

As I think I said in my remarks, when we went out to the provinces and territories, but mainly to the stakeholders, they wanted it to be accountable and transparent. They felt that the bilateral agreements maybe hadn't been able to show what you were getting for that money. In choosing the indicators and moving towards what will be a plan built on national standards, the transfer will be sorted out with data—

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

Just to be clear, the Liberal platform promised $250 million in 2021-22 and $625 million for 2022-23, so that's $875 million that should have been spent or budgeted for by now specifically for the Canada mental health transfer.

I think what I'm hearing you say is that stakeholders asked not to spend that money in those two years. Can you please point to which stakeholders specifically asked the government to wait, to not spend that money right now and wait for later?

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

What the stakeholders wanted was more money for the substance use and addictions program, for the mental health promotion innovation programs, for distinctions-based mental health and for veterans, and they wanted the $45 million to establish the national standards.

The provinces and—

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

For the $875 million that was promised in the platform for a Canada mental health transfer and has not been delivered yet, which specific stakeholders have said not to spend that money right now because they need to consult more? You pointed multiple times to stakeholder input.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

I have been from coast to coast in this country. There were concerns that the $5 billion in the bilateral agreements wasn't transparent and accountable in terms of the money that was being spent. They wanted us to develop the plan. They wanted us to work on that common statement of principles that the provinces and territories have worked on towards national standards, integrated youth services, digital care integrated into primary care and those kinds of things.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

To be clear, though—

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

They were worried that if the money went without the kind of rigour that is in the child care agreements, we wouldn't be able to prove what works, what doesn't work and how we fund what works.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

I'm sorry, Mr. Chair, but I think that the answer's supposed to be the same length as my question.

To be clear, the Liberal Party—the government—having been in power for six years, didn't consult with the stakeholders prior to making a promise in the 2021 platform.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

There had not been a minister of mental health and addictions before this. The decision was that, being appointed minister, I needed to get out and talk with the grassroots and the people delivering the service from coast to coast to coast.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

That wasn't the promise. The promise made was for, so far, $875 million to have been spent or budgeted by now.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

What I'm saying is that we are totally committed to that $4.5 billion that will be, over the next years.... We need to get it right. We need to make sure it goes to the—

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

Just to be clear, though, the platform promised that the money would have been spent right now. Was it a mistake to have made that promise at election time?

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

I'm saying that for the $600 million that the provinces and territories are getting now in the bilateral agreements, we are looking at how that money is being spent. We want to make sure it gets results as we build the mental health transfer based on national standards.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

Can you tell me what the current 24-7 suicide prevention hotline number is in Canada today?

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

I know that if I google “suicide” on my phone, which is what happens to people now, I will get that number right away.

We are committed to getting this done. As we've told you before, there is a real interest in getting it right and learning from the—

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Wetaskiwin, AB]

Minister, if you had a friend—

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I'm sorry, Mr. Lake. That's your time.

Next we're going to go to Dr. Hanley, please, for six minutes.

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister Bennett and all the officials, for appearing today. Thanks for the hard work that all of you are doing.

Mr. Chair, I would like to save the last two minutes of my six minutes for Mr. Morrice to have a chance for a question, if you'd be kind enough to help me with that.

Minister Bennett, I'm certainly very happy to see the B.C. exemption. I know you agree with me that the toxic drug crisis is not a “B.C.-only” problem. My constituency of the Yukon still has among the most per capita deaths in the toxic drug crisis. It's a crisis that touches communities across the country—families, parents, children, indigenous and racialized people, and young people everywhere. I believe the agreement is a big step in the right direction.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on the potential for decriminalization of personal possession in other jurisdictions in Canada and your thoughts on a future national approach.

Particularly, have other jurisdictions already expressed an interest in pursuing decriminalization of personal possession in their regions? Can you update us on which ones?

Maybe I'll stop there and let you speak to that.

[Carolyn Bennett, Liberal, Toronto—St. Paul's, ON]

First, I want to thank you, Dr. Hanley, for your leadership on this. I think that debate in the House of Commons really demonstrated that this crisis is touching members across the House and real people, families and loved ones of parliamentarians from coast to coast to coast.

We believe the B.C. exemption is a huge first step in cracking open this big door and in being able to do it in an evidence-based way, with the appropriate indicators for public health and for public safety. We have to make sure that we build, during the pre-exemption period, a process that will get us the data in real time and a dashboard. We have to be able to evaluate in real time how we are making a difference and that it's still in the public interest.

I have received an application from the Toronto Board of Health, and we are working with them. We understand many jurisdictions have passed motions, but we haven't received any other applications yet. We believe they should be forthcoming from Montreal, Edmonton and maybe the police forces in Saskatoon and Regina.