Evidence of meeting #38 for Health in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Marie-Hélène Sauvé  Legislative Clerk
Lynne Tomson  Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Health
Gillian Pranke  Assistant Commissioner, Assessment, Benefit and Service Branch, Canada Revenue Agency
Nadine Leblanc  Senior Vice-President, Policy, Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation

8:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

Okay.

Do you now have interpretation?

8:05 p.m.

Bloc

Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC

Yes, interpretation services have resumed.

8:05 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

Okay.

Mr. Davies has posed a question as to the fact that the territories are not included in paragraph 4(1)(d). I would like to refer the question to the legislative clerks or the officials.

Who wants to take that?

Go ahead, Ms. Tomson.

8:05 p.m.

Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Health

Lynne Tomson

I will ask my legal services to chime in here, but I believe that the term “province” does include territories. That's why it's not explicitly put in this bill. The Interpretation Act allows for that. It is included. It's just not explicit.

8:10 p.m.

NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Thank you. I am content with that.

8:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

Are there further interventions with respect to clause 2?

Go ahead, Mr. Shields.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB

Are we doing subclause 2(2) on the definition of “adjusted income”?

8:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

We are doing clause 2 in total, so if you have a concern over a specific aspect of clause 2, this is the time to raise it.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB

On the definition of adjusted income, I see what you have listed here in referring to dates. I understand that adjustment is flexible, but I don't know what the definition of “adjusted income” is under the Income Tax Act.

8:10 p.m.

Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic Policy Branch, Department of Health

Lynne Tomson

Mr. Chair, I will ask my colleague Gillian Pranke to answer that question.

October 24th, 2022 / 8:10 p.m.

Gillian Pranke Assistant Commissioner, Assessment, Benefit and Service Branch, Canada Revenue Agency

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

For the purposes of the act, adjusted income has the same meaning as in section 122.6 of the Income Tax Act. It refers to the total of all amounts of income received for the year for the individual or the person who was the individual's cohabiting spouse or common-law partner, namely family, which is spouse, plus spouse/partner. It's income at a specific date based on the composition of the family at that date.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB

Further to that, on adjusted income, in my simple mind I know what gross income is, what net income is.... In dealing with adjusted income, I can deal with adjusted dates in here. Are you talking about income in the adjusted dates?

8:10 p.m.

Assistant Commissioner, Assessment, Benefit and Service Branch, Canada Revenue Agency

Gillian Pranke

Mr. Chair, if I may, for the vast majority of citizens, the adjusted family net income represents line 23600 of the tax return. It's essentially family net income minus any universal child care benefit—the UCCB—and registered disability savings plan—the RDSP—income received, plus any amounts that were repaid. For the vast majority of citizens, it represents the family net income.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Martin Shields Conservative Bow River, AB

You know, that would be a lot simpler. We all would have understood it. You've put “adjusted income”. That is not something that we are used to reading and saying. You've put in here something that is just not clear, whereas with “net income”, people would understand. I'm just saying, bureaucracy rules, and that one is just not clear. That's my opinion.

8:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

Are there any further interventions with respect to clause 2?

Dr. Ellis, go ahead.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Stephen Ellis Conservative Cumberland—Colchester, NS

Thank you, Chair.

In going along with that, is this a term, this “adjusted income”, that we can expect to see coming forward in more bills? Is this something new? Is “net income” passé now? I'm unsure as to the reasoning for creating a new term. Is this something we're going to see going forward from the CRA?

8:10 p.m.

Assistant Commissioner, Assessment, Benefit and Service Branch, Canada Revenue Agency

Gillian Pranke

Mr. Chair, it's a definition that's used in the Income Tax Act. As the Canada dental benefit is being pursued and it's linked to the Income Tax Act, the same definition applies.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Stephen Ellis Conservative Cumberland—Colchester, NS

I think we're speaking different languages, but that's okay. I don't speak CRA.

I can speak doctor. I don't speak CRA.

8:10 p.m.

An hon. member

I bet you can write doctor too.

8:10 p.m.

Conservative

Stephen Ellis Conservative Cumberland—Colchester, NS

I can write doctor too.

8:10 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

Are there any further interventions in respect of clause 2?

(Clause 2 agreed to)

(On clause 3)

We're now on clause 3.

I believe that the Bloc has an amendment.

Mr. Garon, you may move your amendment.

8:15 p.m.

Bloc

Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC

I'm sorry, Mr. Chair, I will need a few seconds because my papers are a little jumbled. Are my colleagues willing to give me a minute?

8:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

Would you like me to suspend the meeting?

8:15 p.m.

Bloc

Jean-Denis Garon Bloc Mirabel, QC

Yes, please.

8:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Sean Casey

All right, we will suspend for three minutes.