Health Committee on Nov. 29th, 2022

[Dr. Supriya Sharma]

You know, as I think Minister Bennett said, words matter. Recovery is really about getting people to a place where they are in the best health possible. That's a journey. We're trying to limit harms from substance use. The underlying illnesses that cause substance use disorder are really complicated, but the goal is to have people in good physical and mental health.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Dr. Sharma and Ms. Goodridge.

The last round of questions for this panel will be posed by Mr. van Koeverden.

You have the next five minutes, please.

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I appreciate the time that you've provided us with today and all of the answers we've received to these questions. Thank you very much for being here, and thank you for what you've done to be able to produce these supplementary estimates.

My questions today will focus on kids. They won't be specifically directed to any official.

I think Canadians are sometimes concerned, and very rightly so, perhaps, with the way the Canada health transfer is set up and the federal government's ability to be able to target certain priorities. Specifically, I've been focused on children and on children's health care, particularly preventative health care, and trying to find ways as the federal government to have a positive impact on the health of kids in Canada.

We've seen through various reports that the health of kids in many respects is heading in a negative trajectory rather than in a positive one. We would like to think that in Canada, being a wealthy country with lots of resources, we should be able to do better. It's challenging, though, because many of those priorities are difficult to find in a document like supplementary estimates. Our funding goes to provinces in such a general manner.

Can you speak a little bit—this is for anybody who would like to—about the relationship the federal government has with provinces and territories and about how we can start setting some priorities so that we can tackle some of the biggest national issues our country faces with respect to kids?

[Dr. Stephen Lucas]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I will start, and then I'll turn it over to Heather Jeffrey to speak further.

Certainly, support for children's health is a key priority for Health Canada and the Public Health Agency and in work at the Canadian Institutes of Health Research, including work they've recently moved ahead on in terms of supporting research into pediatric cancer. We use federal responsibilities as well as convening to support other areas, including healthy eating through a tailored use of the Canada food guide; healthy living and active living as another key area to support communities and children's programs across the country, working with community groups; and a focus on pediatric medicine, as we've been discussing, certainly recognizing from a regulatory perspective that we need more targeted efforts on tracking pediatric medicines and formulations in Canada.

Importantly, to your question, one of the areas in which we're working closely with the provinces through targeted bilateral funding under the 2018 agreements on mental health and substance use is integrated youth services, where, as Minister Bennett noted, we've made significant progress across the country.

I'll turn to Heather Jeffrey to give you a little bit more information on that.

[Heather Jeffrey]

Integrated Youth Services, as Minister Bennett outlined, was an important priority area of the $5 billion in investments in mental health bilateral agreements that were made. That is ongoing.

She spoke as well to the fact that integrated youth services, which are really about receiving youth with peer counsellors who understand their living experience, wrapping them with the full suite of support services they need—medical, social, housing—and ensuring they have all the supports they need to get through their challenges....

We now have 50 operational sites as a result of those investments in our partnership with provinces, and there are an additional 60 under development.

We also know that youth need to be reached in different ways. Text and virtual online services, through Wellness Together Canada, have been very successful in reaching, in particular, LGBTQ+ youth and others who want to speak with others with the same experiences they are going through. An additional $15 million investment to Kids Help Phone is part of that to make sure that youth who are in crisis have someone to reach out to 24-7.

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

Thank you very much.

Moving on to vaccination, from the perspective of some of the most avoidable diseases like measles, mumps and rubella, as well as the flu, we've seen that some jurisdictions across the country have been a little more hesitant in their messaging in encouraging their populations. I am speaking particularly of very young children and the elderly.

Parents in my riding have been writing to me about their concerns that their children are more susceptible to some of these very avoidable diseases because of lower vaccination rates.

How can the federal government encourage provinces and territories to be more proactive in encouraging their communities to get vaccinated for some of these diseases we didn't need to worry about as much a couple of years ago?

[Dr. Howard Njoo, Deputy Chief Public Health Officer and Interim Vice President, Infectious Diseases Programs Branch, Public Health Agency of Canada]

I will go at it in two ways. Certainly in terms of routine vaccine preventable diseases, I think COVID-19 has had an impact.

In the provinces and territories we've had very good discussions with the chief MOHs, and they do acknowledge there has been some slippage. Obviously because of public health measures over the past two years, some children haven't been able to go to clinics and get their routine vaccinations against measles, and so on.

However, we have been fortunate so far with historically higher vaccine coverage for what we call the “routine childhood vaccine-preventable diseases”. I think we haven't had many cases of measles reported, and even in the last year or so, since March 2021 until November 1 of this year, we have actually had three reported cases of measles to date. They're all imported and associated with travel.

It doesn't mean that we can rest on our laurels, and I think our provinces are continuing to do their quota to catch up with regard to routine measles and other childhood vaccine preventable diseases.

With respect to what's happening right now, and I think we all see it in the media, there's the triple menace of COVID-19 still being around and influenza and, especially for young children, RSV. I think it speaks to the fact that for the past couple of years there hasn't been the exposure to the viruses that might have been happening in previous years.

I think the message is that the federal government, and certainly with the provinces and territories, for which there are vaccines available.... At this point it is COVID-19 and now there are vaccines available for those six months and older, obviously as well as for influenza. You can also give those to children six months and over.

I would say that we want to continue pushing, supporting provinces and territories, be it with various campaigns, and also supporting what's happening at a local level to say that everyone should avail themselves, because if we can prevent ongoing transmission of both influenza and COVID-19 by using vaccine, as well as good public health measures at a personal level, continuing the use of masks, etc.—certainly in indoor spaces—and good hand hygiene, all of that is going to contribute to mitigating against transmission and protecting our children.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Dr. Njoo.

Thank you, Mr. van Koeverden.

To all of our officials, thank you so much for being with us. Thank you for all that you do to support Canadians and provide us with good and thorough information that's presented patiently and professionally.

We're going to move right to the votes now. You're all welcome to stay, but you're free to leave.

Thank you.

Colleagues, there are eight votes in all in the supplementary estimates (B) 2022-23. If I have unanimous consent, we can group the eight votes together. Absent unanimous consent, we'll deal with each one individually.

Do we have unanimous consent to group all eight votes together?

[Some hon. members]

No.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I will now put the question on each vote separately.

Mr. Clerk, we'll have a standing vote.

CANADIAN FOOD INSPECTION AGENCY

Vote 1b—Operating expenditures, grants and contributions..........16,128,427

(Vote 1b agreed to: yeas 7; nays 4)

CANADIAN INSTITUTES OF HEALTH RESEARCH

Vote 1b—Operating expenditures..........6,377,773

Vote 5b—Grants..........92,357,334

(Votes 1b and 5b agreed to on division)

DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH

Vote 1b—Operating expenditures..........142,194,433

Vote 10b—Grants and contributions..........28,201,095

(Votes 1b and 10b agreed to on division)

PUBLIC HEALTH AGENCY OF CANADA

Vote 1b—Operating expenditures..........1,317,165,601

Vote 5b—Capital expenditures..........11,150,000

Vote 10b—Grants and contributions..........34,451,915

(Votes 1b, 5b and 10b agreed to on division)

Shall I report the supplementary estimates (B) to the House?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Is it the will of the committee to adjourn the meeting?

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Excuse me, Mr. Chair.

Are we not having a meeting on Thursday? Is that not true?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I received a text during this meeting, indicating that the whips have agreed that the health committee meeting on Thursday will be cancelled. That's the information I have as well.

[Adam van Koeverden, Liberal, Milton, ON]

Since we're not adjourned yet, does that mean there might be time for private members' business on Tuesday next week?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I'm in the hands of the committee. Certainly, Ms. Romanado is ready to present.

We have the report to finish, but we have two pieces of private members' business that we need to deal with as well. They've been referred by the House.

Mr. Ellis, go ahead.

[Stephen Ellis, Conservative, Cumberland—Colchester, NS]

Thank you, Chair.

We've been at this report forever. My suggestion is if we really believe that there is a health care crisis in this country, we need to get that report out before we start looking at private members' business.

That's my two cents' worth. Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

That was, otherwise, the plan for Thursday. It was to continue with the report.

Once again, I'm in the hands of the committee on that.

I would say that unless there appears to be consensus, we'll continue on with the report.

Mr. Davies, go ahead.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

Yes, and I would just point out that we also have the children's health study, so we already have two open files. I would rather work on those before we open a third one on private members' business.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Yes, okay.

Go ahead, Mr. Jowhari.

[Majid Jowhari, Liberal, Richmond Hill, ON]

Mr. Chair, I believe we are very close to the conclusion of the report, and, if we agree as a matter of planning to be in a position that, once we've completed the plan, if there's time left, about an hour can be dedicated to the private members' motions—at least one of them—and we'll move on to the other studies on the Thursday following. That's from a planning point of view.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I want to consult with the clerk on one thing. I think, if we leave the private members' business in abeyance long enough, it's deemed reported back to the House. I need to consult on that first, because, if there is a deadline, you need to know it.

It appears that we're not mandated to deal with it before Christmas, as much as that might be the will of the committee, and it's certainly the will of the sponsors of the bills.

Ms. Goodridge, you have the floor.

[Laila Goodridge, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I appreciate the suggestions from my colleagues to try to fit it in so we can get as much in as possible, but I think that you are putting the cart before the horse if we do it that way.

I think that specifically the bill on firefighters' cancer is something that deserves to have witnesses so that we make sure this is set up properly. I'm the member of Parliament for Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, and firefighters in my community saw what was an entire lifetime's worth of exposure to many of these carcinogens in a month's time, so I think it is incumbent on us not to try to rush through this just to rubber-stamp it.

I think this is a critically important bill. This is not about being obstructionist; this is about making sure that we are doing our due diligence as parliamentarians to ensure that the best possible legislation is going forward. Knowing that we do not have a deadline of the Christmas break ahead of us, let's plan for success rather than try to just jam everything in.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Okay, thank you, Mrs. Goodridge.

I'm going to come to you, Mr. Davies and Mr. van Koeverden.

First, the deadline is 60 sitting days from when it was referred to the House. With the two private members' bills, that takes us into late January or early February. We can request a 30-day extension, so, if we don't get it done before Christmas, we are looking at fairly soon in the new year. If we're talking about several meetings with witnesses, it's something that needs to be on our radar, albeit perhaps not immediately.

We have Mr. Davies and then Mr. van Koeverden.

[Don Davies, NDP, Vancouver Kingsway, BC]

I will suggest that we finish the report, and then I'm okay with going to Ms. Romanado's bill. I personally think that the bill should pass very quickly. I'm not averse to hearing from witnesses, but I support it.

The children's health study is something we can schedule at our own pace. The other two matters I think are more pressing. I would hope that we can get through the report in the next two or three meetings.

I want to take a moment just to ask the analysts again for a clean copy of the report that contains all of the amendments up to date, maybe highlighting what's been parked so we can most efficiently come back to it and get through that.

I think we're close to coming to the end of the recommendations; we just have to go back to the body of the report to clean up some of the places we parked. Let's get that done and then proceed to Ms. Romanado's bill.