Evidence of meeting #7 for Health in the 45th Parliament, 1st session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was doctors.
A video is available from Parliament.
Bloc
Luc Thériault Bloc Montcalm, QC
I have a question for you, Dr. Bernard.
I don't know how long you've been in your position, but do you remember if Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada even consulted your organization about those targets?
President, College of Family Physicians of Canada
At this point in time, in the time that I've been in the position, there has not been a consultation. This is our first consultation.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Hedy Fry
Thank you very much, Doctor.
I now go to the second round. It's a five-minute round. I think, given the time, that we may not be able to do the whole two parts of the round. We had agreed that we would end at five minutes after.
I'll go to Ms. Konanz for five minutes, please.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Thank you, Chair.
My first question is for Ms. Price. It's a yes-or-no question.
Did the federal immigration department consult with the Federation of Medical Regulatory Authorities of Canada on this year's federal immigration levels plan?
Executive Director, Federation of Medical Regulatory Authorities of Canada
No.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Did the federal immigration department ask your organization for data on the current capacity of Canada's health care system?
Executive Director, Federation of Medical Regulatory Authorities of Canada
No.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Yes or no, would you like to be consulted?
Executive Director, Federation of Medical Regulatory Authorities of Canada
Yes.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Thank you.
My next question is for Dr. Bichay.
I want to say first that I am so sorry for what you've had to go through. I appreciate your story, especially since you don't have to go to northern Ontario—you can and that would be great, but—
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
—come to Prince George, as my colleague just said. Or come to the Okanagan, the Boundary Country, the Kootenays or Similkameen in my region in British Columbia, and you will find hospitals that are closing for multiple days a year. Emergency rooms are closing suddenly, some for 50 days a year, because they don't have enough doctors and nurses. I really appreciate your story, and I'm glad we're going to do something about it.
Dr. Bichay, it has been reported that there are 5,000 internationally trained physicians practising in B.C. Do you have an estimate for how many physicians, nurses and other medical professionals might be trained but are unable to practise in British Columbia?
Director, Internationally Trained Physicians of Canada
I don't have an exact number, but I know there are thousands of us all over the country, in every province.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
Dr. Bichay, with your heartfelt story, were you promised a position as a doctor? Were you promised that before you came over, before you committed your life and your family's lives to moving to Canada?
Director, Internationally Trained Physicians of Canada
When you see that your immigration scores top up because you are a doctor, you feel that you're going to be appreciated. You feel that you're going to have an opportunity to practise medicine over here. When you feel that your credentials are verified, you feel that this country is welcoming you and that they need you, but when you land here, you find many barriers coming one after the other. When you fulfill one requirement, you get other barriers.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
It sounds like that.
Is there an issue where internationally trained professionals in Canada can't get credentials recognized in Canada and then go to the United States instead?
Director, Internationally Trained Physicians of Canada
I've seen many people.... After trying for many years, of course, you lose hope. You cannot keep pushing here if you cannot practise your profession in the end. If you're offered...in another country, either the U.S. or U.K..... I've seen people going to Australia. If you see that there's an opportunity for you, you go there, of course.
Conservative
Helena Konanz Conservative Similkameen—South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC
I'd like to cede my time to Dr. Strauss.
Conservative
Matt Strauss Conservative Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Thank you.
Dr. Bernard, thank you. That was a really helpful presentation, and some of the numbers were very stark. You said that we're 23,000 family doctors short in Canada and that 6.5 million Canadians don't have access to a family doctor.
Not to put too fine of a point on it, but would you agree with me that if I'm one of those 6.5 million Canadians who don't have access to a family doctor, I'm definitionally not receiving proper health care?
President, College of Family Physicians of Canada
Thank you.
Having a family physician is a super important part of having access to the excellent health care that Canadians all expect and deserve.
Conservative
Matt Strauss Conservative Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Definitionally, 15% of Canadians are not receiving proper health care right now, based on those stark numbers.
When you hear Dr. Bichay's story, in your view, does your organization have a pretty good idea of when somebody...?
When Dr. Bichay gives her demographic data, such as her age, the med school she went to and her test scores—the sorts of things she gave to Immigration Canada—would your organization have a pretty good sense, based on data, of whether she's likely to be successful in obtaining a Canadian licence?
President, College of Family Physicians of Canada
I don't think we have drilled the data down to the likelihood of success because there are so many factors. It's very dependent on province, what is needed in each province and what particular.... The PRAs in certain provinces will allow somebody to practise without certain skills but not other provinces.
It would be difficult to guess whether someone—
Conservative
Matt Strauss Conservative Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Thank you.
Ms. Price, when you hear that, I should think that if the family doctor college gives an immigrant with permanent residence the proper certification, they would almost certainly be able to practise in each province.
Executive Director, Federation of Medical Regulatory Authorities of Canada
Yes, certification is one of the important requirements in every province and territory, but, as you've heard from Dr. Bichay, currency of practice will also be an issue for many ITPs.
Conservative
Matt Strauss Conservative Kitchener South—Hespeler, ON
Could you give us a sense, of those who do obtain FCFP, what proportion of those will be allowed to practise in one or another province?
