Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Nov. 27th, 2014

[Alexandrine Latendresse, NDP, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

There are changes right now that involve House of Commons security guards, in particular. I know many of the guards are putting in a lot of overtime and feeling a lot of pressure. Do we intend to help them out with their mental well-being? Can we at least make sure they get the rest they need to function properly? Is that being taken into account?

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

I could ask Mr. Vickers for some of the very specific aspects of what the security department offers its employees.

[Kevin Vickers, Sergeant-at-Arms, House of Commons]

Mr. Chair, since the events of October 22, we have prepared various options for our members. For example, several of them took leave so they could rest up properly.

We also have administrative policies here, at the House of Commons, including the Employee Assistance Program. They have access to those, but I am convinced that our members are in good health. If they did require some assistance, it would be at their disposal.

[Alexandrine Latendresse, NDP, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Very well. I am pleased to hear it. Since they are looking after us, we want to take good care of them also.

I have a question about the increased number of members of Parliament under Bill C-20, adopted two years ago. Do you have a better idea of the costs involved in adding 30 seats to the House of Commons?

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

We do. It's relatively simple to work out because every member outside the National Capital Region gets the same entitlement to the travel points system and there are certain usage patterns that we can predict based on that. Of course the members' operating budgets, the MOBs, are set for all members. So we do have those numbers and they will be coming through in the main estimates for next year.

There will be a $25-million addition to the mains, when it's fully implemented.

[Alexandrine Latendresse, NDP, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Would the House be ready in case of a spring election? Would the House be ready to seat 338 mps? Will the system be set up?

[Marc Bosc, Acting Clerk of the House of Commons, House of Commons]

Yes indeed, Ms. Latendresse, steps were taken over two years ago to begin to prepare the House for that. Our carpenters have managed to develop, with great imagination I might add, a proposal that was submitted to the Board of Internal Economy, and accepted.

The new seats will therefore be installed during the dissolution of Parliament. Our solution is reasonable, financially-speaking. I remind you that we will be in this building for only a few more years, before moving to the West Block. We wanted to find a workable solution for the current premises without generating too many costs. Your own committee chair was part of a focus group that tested a mock-up of the new seats.

[Alexandrine Latendresse, NDP, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you very much.

How much time do I have left, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

They wanted to see if small people like me would also fit in these new seats we're going to use. A few of my same-sized colleagues and I tested it and it's very beautiful. It will work for us very well.

I'm sorry; I'm using your time. You're at six minutes. You have one and a half minutes, when you count the extra time from Mr. Lukiwski.

[Alexandrine Latendresse, NDP, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I understood the explanations pertaining to the Asia-Pacific Parliamentary Forum. These funds are only to be used to prepare to host in 2016. They are not slated for the forum that will take place this year, is that correct?

[Marc Bosc]

That is correct. Those funds will allow staff to begin to prepare, which includes site visits, for example.

[Alexandrine Latendresse, NDP, Louis-Saint-Laurent, QC]

That is fine.

That is all I wanted to know.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joe Preston]

Great.

Mr. Lamoureux, I'm giving you lots of time today, so take what you need.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Oh, a bonus.

I want to pick up on a couple of points. I'm glad, Mr. Speaker, that you made reference to security. Yes, there is a net benefit to our amalgamating into one security service, but there's no doubt that there's a need for us to enhance the amount of security on the Hill. That's obviously a fair assessment.

What is our actual total budget for security today?

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

It's approximately $22 million in the main estimates.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

When you look forward, do you anticipate that we will have a minimum of $22 million going forward? I think there's a certain degree of expectation that we can learn a lot from this. There may have been some deficiencies for which we'd be able to compensate going forward.

Are you anticipating an increase in the security budget?

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

Already a couple of items have been approved by the board. Some of those are one-time costs associated, for example, with arming the constables. Some of them are ongoing costs. Those costs that are associated with the increased measures will include one-off spending, such as for equipment or materials that are provided. But things that relate to, say, training, or for example on the security side, some of the HR issues that may lead to longer shifts and a unified force will be incorporated into the main estimates.

So yes, the overall picture in the main estimates, as these measures are implemented, will change.

[Marc Bosc]

Mr. Lamoureux, I would just add that because of the announcement made by the Speaker on Tuesday regarding a unified force, much needs to be worked out with our colleagues on the Senate side. We're planning at an administrative level to meet and discuss those kinds of details, financial and otherwise, that need to be worked out to make this unification work at an administrative level. Necessarily the Senate has a security budget and we have a security budget, and both of them have money assigned to them, so that's part of the discussion.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Pardon me, because I'm learning. I realize that you don't want to disclose some information, and I can appreciate that, but I have personally noticed a stronger presence, for example, of RCMP officers on the Hill.

How is that taken into consideration? Is it a part of your budget? Is it something that's just provided through the RCMP? I don't quite understand that aspect.

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

The RCMP is responsible for security on the grounds, for everything outside the doors. After the events of October 22, I made a request for an increased presence. As you mentioned, you can notice that at entry points to Centre Block there are now armed RCMP personnel. That will be reflected in the RCMP budget.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

Right.

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

As Marc mentioned, we're very pleased internally that we were able to unify the two forces. A lot of good work was done by counterparts on the Senate side and members of the board subcommittee on security. We have now tasked our respective administrations to make it happen. As Marc mentioned, there are many things to do associated with this, everything from HR to certain systems, and that's all being done.

I think it's safe to say that the direction that was given from the Speaker and from the Board of Internal Economy to the House administration, and the same thing on the Senate side, was that we want this accomplished in short order. As this happens, we'll be able to speak more to it, but right now it's being ironed out at that level.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

But as far as, let's say, the RCMP are concerned, are they incorporated into this particular budget? It's separate, is it?

[Andrew Scheer, Conservative, Regina—Qu'Appelle, SK]

It's separate. As Marc said, the House has a budget and the Senate has a budget. As the forces are amalgamated, we're looking at the most effective way to roll those budgets together. But that's separate from what the RCMP provides.

[Kevin Lamoureux, Liberal, Winnipeg North, MB]

If you take a look at the bigger picture, it's well in excess of $22 million. It's probably closer to $50 million, but that would be a pure guesstimate. The $22 million we're referring to is just in-House security.