Evidence of meeting #155 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was building.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Rob Wright  Assistant Deputy Minister, Parliamentary Precinct Branch, Department of Public Works and Government Services
Jennifer Garrett  Director General, Centre Block Program, Department of Public Works and Government Services
Larry Malcic  Architect, Centrus Architects
Michel Patrice  Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons
Stéphan Aubé  Chief Information Officer, House of Commons

12:35 p.m.

NDP

David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON

There you go. See?

12:35 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Parliamentary Precinct Branch, Department of Public Works and Government Services

Rob Wright

I think at this point there are no plans to reintroduce it that I am aware of.

12:35 p.m.

NDP

David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON

I didn't think so, but it would be really cool if there were. I leave that out there. Maybe there are some creative folks.

I have two things, one point and then a question.

The point is that I really appreciated knowing for the first time how you're looking at the parliamentary precinct differently. Right now, truly, we have a frankenparl. In the decade and a half that I've been on the Hill, we added a committee space here and grabbed offices there. It's been pulled together with duct tape and bale wire. It doesn't make any sense when you talk about flow. So I'm pleased to hear that we're going to get away from that nonsense, take a step back and look at all the facilities as they all start to blend, and the idea that we may still have to be off the Hill, whereas we weren't in the past. When I first got here, everything was nice and neat on the Hill. So I'm pleased about that.

I share some of the concerns that Mr. Reid has raised about the visitor welcome centre. When you're providing the committee with the list of decisions and the time frames, I assume this will be a part of that; that a detailed subset will speak to exactly where we are with the visitor welcome centre in the decisions that are made and are not being revisited versus those that, going forward, have not been made, and what your thinking is on when and how those decisions are going to made. I would ask that you include that in the report you provide to us.

12:40 p.m.

Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons

Michel Patrice

It's been noted.

12:40 p.m.

NDP

David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON

You keep saying “noted”. I assume that “noted” is your word for yes.

12:40 p.m.

Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons

12:40 p.m.

NDP

David Christopherson NDP Hamilton Centre, ON

That's very good. Thank you.

12:40 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Larry Bagnell

Madame Lapointe.

May 14th, 2019 / 12:40 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

I want to come back to some of the things that several parliamentarians and I have discussed, but I still feel that I've had no clear answer.

When you first came here on December 11, you said that the rehabilitation of the Centre Block was intended “to safeguard and honour its heritage... to support the work of parliamentarians; to accommodate the institution's evolving needs; to enhance the visitor experience; and to modernize the building's infrastructure.”

I am very concerned about the part about parliamentarians.

On March 19, you said that the Board of Internal Economy would set up a working group. We raised the issue a number of times to find out who would be involved in the working group, but I have heard nothing yet about parliamentarians. However, recently, we were consulted about cutting down an elm tree. Since Parliament will probably not sit until January, who will be consulted if decisions on next steps have to be made by then?

12:40 p.m.

Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons

Michel Patrice

As I said, we will have a working group of three people. So far, I have received two names and I prefer to wait until I have the third before—

12:40 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

There are only five weeks left.

12:40 p.m.

Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons

Michel Patrice

I should receive the third name by the end of this week.

12:40 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

We were consulted about the felling of a tree. However, I think we have more major decisions to make than cutting down a tree.

12:40 p.m.

Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons

12:40 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

That being said, I apologize to those who care a lot about trees.

I am thinking of questions such as when to decide on the number of members, whether or not to set up a parallel debating chamber or whether or not to excavate—my colleague said earlier that there is rock here, under the building.

By the way, I don't feel reassured, because I didn't get the answer I wanted.

When you renovated the West Block, you had to excavate rock because that's all there is under the building. You are now saying that you will have to excavate in front of the Centre Block. What did you learn from the excavation work you did here? What are the best practices you have learned that you will be able to apply to your work on the Centre Block?

12:40 p.m.

Deputy Clerk, Administration, House of Commons

Michel Patrice

I hope that the members of the working group will be able to meet after the next break. For the time being, the leaders of each of the parties in the House have appointed members to sit on this working group, as decided by the Board of Internal Economy.

The general and specific concerns of committee members were heard. The Visitor Welcome Centre will be one of the priority topics before the adjournment in June. Discussions will begin and a list of questions or concerns that parliamentarians have raised with the working group will be compiled. The group will then report to the Board of Internal Economy, which will present it to this committee as soon as possible.

As for the lessons learned from the construction work at the West Block, I'll let Mr. Wright tell you about that.

12:45 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Parliamentary Precinct Branch, Department of Public Works and Government Services

Rob Wright

There have been many lessons learned and I think we could have a deep conversation about that. There would be two that would be relevant to today's conversation that would be very important.

One is, as Ms. Garrett mentioned, the layered decision-making approach and to focus on those elements that we can get consensus on and to move forward on them. That lends itself to phased implementation. In the middle of the West Block we started to shift gears, in working between Public Services Procurement Canada and the House of Commons. We're going to apply that lesson learned fully for Centre Block.

It's the phased approach, really focusing on those structural elements, first and foremost, where we can get the greatest clarity early, and then, once we have the clarity of the functionality that we have, focusing the effort, from a construction perspective, on areas that need to be perfect for the operations of Parliament, the chamber being perhaps the most obvious of those, and committee rooms. They should be completed earlier and handed over to the House of Commons, which is the technical authority on the IT and broadcasting elements. The construction elements of the building and all of the critical IT elements should be finished at the same time, rather than being sequential, which is what we used to do previously in projects. The Wellington Building and the Valour Building and elements of that would have been more sequential. We think we can save time and enhance the quality by approaching it with a more phased approach.

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

I still have some questions.

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Larry Bagnell

One quick question.

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

On March 19, when you appeared before the committee, you said that 20% of the decommissioning process had already been completed. Today, May 14, what is the percentage?

12:45 p.m.

Director General, Centre Block Program, Department of Public Works and Government Services

Jennifer Garrett

I believe that 20% was in reference to the decommissioning process. We are approximately 40% decommissioned. We're on track to finish those decommissioning activities in an August 2019 time frame, with a view of being able to transition the building back from parliamentary partners to PSPC, and then a very rapid turnover to our construction manager, who will take over custody of the site and stand up the construction site.

There are key elements that need to come out of the building. We've moved quite a bit of the moveable assets, things like artifacts and furniture, especially those to support parliamentary operations, but there are residual assets in the building and some pretty important artifacts. A good example are the war paintings in the Senate chamber. Two of the six are down, and the remaining six will be moved by a mid-June time frame.

Most importantly, on the House of Commons side, is the decommissioning of the IT infrastructure in the building. That is ongoing as we speak and is well in progress, but has to be completed, as well as some of the activities to isolate the building, so it can be taken essentially off the grid.

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

Linda Lapointe Liberal Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

Okay, thank you.

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Larry Bagnell

Before I go to Mr. Reid, I have one question. It came up during our study on a family-friendly House of Commons and I think it was mentioned one of the times you were here before. It was the suggestion that one of the things you might look at is play space or a playground, either outside as Mr. Reid suggested, as part of the courtyard, or indoors. Has any thought been given to that?

12:45 p.m.

Some hon. members

Oh, oh!

12:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Larry Bagnell

Mr. Nater, respect, please!

I'm hearing a long silence.