Procedure and House Affairs Committee on April 19th, 2018

[Blake Richards, Conservative, Banff—Airdrie, AB]

Thanks.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Okay, thank you.

Thank you very much for coming.

We're just going to suspend for a bit to get on video conference with our next witnesses.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Welcome back to the 97th meeting of the committee, as we continue our study on the use of indigenous languages in proceedings of the House of Commons.

We're joined by Cheryle Herman, Dene Language Revitalization Coach. She is appearing by video conference from Saskatoon. Thank you very much for making yourself available today. You can make an opening statement and then some of the committee members will have some questions.

[Cheryle Herman, Dene Language Revitilization Coach, As an Individual]

Thank you.

[Witness speaks in Dene]

[English]

My name is Cheryle Herman. I am from Clearwater River Dene Nation located near La Loche, Saskatchewan. I am a fluent speaker of the Denesuline language. I am here as an ambassador of indigenous languages, to share my own and other individuals' thoughts on the importance of using our indigenous languages in House of Commons proceedings.

To use indigenous languages in the House of Commons would be an acknowledgement of the original inhabitants of the land and it would mean that the government honours and respects this fact. It would also demonstrate that the government is working toward righting historical injustices and toward a more inclusive and collaborative relationship.

Indigenous languages encompass who we are as indigenous people. Communication in our languages is sacred. Without our languages and our cultures, we are no longer indigenous. Our language defines who we are and where we come from, and is therefore essential to our survival as a nation.

Language connects us to the spiritual ground. The intent of all communication is embedded with strength, clarity, and purpose when spoken in our mother tongue.

Language impacts the daily lives of members of all races, creeds, and regions of the world. Language helps express our feelings, desires, and queries to the world around us. Words, gestures, and tone are utilized in union to portray a broad spectrum of emotion.

The unique and diverse methods that human beings can use to communicate through written and spoken language are a large part of what allows us to harness our innate ability to form lasting bonds with one another. They also separate humankind from the rest of the animal kingdom.

Additionally, the ability to communicate in multiple languages is becoming more and more important in the increasingly integrated global business community. Communicating directly with new clients and companies in their native language is one of the first steps to forming a lasting, stable international business relationship.

The strength and value of verbal agreements in our languages leads to stronger, respectful, and honourable relationships. Being able to do this automatically puts any multilingual person miles ahead of his or her peers in the competition for jobs in high-prestige positions.

Language is such a key aspect to setting up children for success in their future professional endeavours. The government can be a part of their successful future by using indigenous languages in the House of Commons. This may help our indigenous children pursue a future as a leader for their people, or for all of Canada, with confidence, knowing they can speak their indigenous language in the House of Commons.

Although indigenous languages are currently not recognized as official languages in this country, it is important that we value those languages just as we do English and French. In doing so, we affirm the significance of the people who use those languages as forms of communication.

Our languages are still very much alive and are the only form of communication for some of our elders. Therefore, when proceedings are conducted in French and English without any translation for indigenous people, those people do not receive the information that may be of relevance to them and to their government.

We need to continue to advocate to speak our indigenous languages in our places of business in order for them to thrive.

I would like to share some additional points to ponder in consideration of our plight to maintain our indigenous languages. One, indigenous languages create more positive attitudes and less prejudice toward people who are different. Two, analytical skills improve when one speaks an indigenous language. Three, business skills plus indigenous language skills make employees more valuable in the marketplace. Four, dealing with another culture enables people to gain a more profound understanding of their own culture. Five, creativity is increased with the study of indigenous languages. Six, skills like problem-solving and dealing with abstract concepts are increased. Seven, speaking an indigenous language enhances one's opportunities in government, business, medicine, law, technology, military, industry, marketing, etc. Eight, a second language improves skills and grades. Nine, it provides a competitive edge in career choices when one is able to communicate in a second language. Ten, it enhances listening skills and memory. Eleven, one participates more effectively and responsibly in a multicultural world if one knows another language. Twelve, marketable skills in the global economy are improved if you master another language. Thirteen, it offers a sense of the past culturally and linguistically. Fourteen, it teaches and encourages respect for other peoples. It fosters an understanding of the interrelation of language and human nature. Fifteen, indigenous languages expand one's view of the world, liberalize one's experiences, and make one more flexible and tolerant. Sixteen, indigenous languages expand one's world view and limit the barriers between people. Barriers cause distrust and fear. Seventeen, indigenous language study leads to an appreciation of cultural diversity. Eighteen, as immigration increases, we need to prepare for changes in Canadian society. Nineteen, one is at a distinct advantage in the global market if one is as bilingual as possible. Twenty, indigenous languages open the door to art, music, dance, fashion, cuisine, film, philosophy, science, and so forth. Twenty-one, indigenous language study is simply part of a very basic liberal education. To educate is to lead out, to lead out of confinement, narrowness, and darkness.

In addition to the previously mentioned points, the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples also acknowledges the importance of indigenous languages in places of business. Article 13 states:

1. Indigenous peoples have the right to revitalize, use, develop and transmit to future generations their histories, languages, oral traditions, philosophies, writing systems and literatures, and to designate and retain their own names for communities, places and persons.

States shall take effective measures to ensure that this right is protected and also to ensure that indigenous peoples can understand and be understood in political, legal and administrative proceedings, where necessary through the provision of interpretation or by other appropriate means.

Lastly, we need to bring light to the TRC calls to action and ensure that the calls to action are being implemented. I would like to review two calls to action that speak directly to indigenous languages.

Call to action 13 states, “We call upon the federal government to acknowledge that Aboriginal rights include Aboriginal language rights.”

Call to action 14 states, “We call upon the federal government to enact an Aboriginal Languages Act that incorporates the following principles: (i) Aboriginal languages are a fundamental and valued element of Canadian culture and society, and there is an urgency to preserve them.”

Recognition of indigenous languages and support for indigenous language programs stand alongside land rights, health, justice, education, housing, employment, and other services as part of the overall process of pursuing social justice and reconciliation.

In conclusion, I would like to share a quote from Dr. Graham McKay:

One might go so far as to say that without recognition of the Indigenous people and their languages, many other programs will be less effective, because this lack of recognition will show that the underlying attitudes of the dominant society have not changed significantly.

Thank you, mahsi cho for your time and consideration on this very important matter.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Thank you very much, mahsi cho. That was a great outline of the importance of indigenous languages for our committee.

We're just going to have very open questions. We'll start with Mr. Saganash.

[Romeo Saganash, NDP, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

What an honour. I'm starting to like this committee. Thank you.

Cheryle, thank you for that presentation. That was pretty thorough and succinct at the same time.

I don't know if you listened to the earlier panel, but we had some officials from the heritage department, as well as StatsCan. One of the questions I asked them you referred to, in a way, in your presentation; that is, whether we should recognize indigenous peoples' languages as official languages in this country. I know you referred to article 13 of the UN declaration, of course, but also Truth and Reconciliation Commission call to action 14.

I've been attending Assembly of First Nations chiefs' meetings over the last 30 years, and I have never seen a standing ovation such as the one that the current Prime Minister got when he announced the aboriginal languages act that they would enact. Everyone in the room was thrilled about that. I was thrilled about that too. I even stood up to applaud the Prime Minister.

In my view, the way that call to action 14 is written does not necessarily go in that direction. It says that the act must contain the following principles, the first one being “Aboriginal languages are a fundamental and valued element of Canadian culture and society”. What is your opinion on whether we should recognize aboriginal languages as official languages in this country?

[Cheryle Herman]

I think it would be going further in terms of preserving indigenous languages and maintaining indigenous languages and cultures.

I recently visited Northwest Territories, and they are a long way ahead of us in the work that they're doing to maintain their languages there. They're mandating things for curriculum and for language used in the places of business. As I stated in my opening remarks, some of our elders don't speak English or French, so when these proceedings happen in these two languages only, our elders are missing out on whatever is going on in terms of government.

[Romeo Saganash, NDP, Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC]

I might have other questions later, but I'll let others have the opportunity.

Thank you, Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Mr. Reid.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Open sessions involve the chair's favourites getting to ask the questions, so it's going to be a rough ride for Mr. Graham.

I want to ask about translation. One of the members of Parliament who has come before this committee talking about the value that having translation would serve is a member of the Dene nation and a Dene speaker. One of the problems that occurred to my mind as she was giving her remarks to us was that we don't have ready availability here to translation services in the Dene language. This is a problem for all aboriginal languages, but it's less of a problem for some and more of a problem for others.

I believe it's a more resolvable problem, for example, for Inuktitut for a number of reasons, one of which is that there's a direct air link between Ottawa and Iqaluit. As well, many unilingual Inuktitut speakers come to Ottawa for medical services, and so on, with the result that there are translators already here. From our point of view, that's the easiest one. Then it gets progressively more difficult.

Dene, because it has a large number of speakers, is potentially one where we can overcome these problems. Let me structure the question this way: are there translators, people who would be capable of doing simultaneous translation in Saskatchewan now, and would they have the skills and the availability to provide these services if those were asked for?

[Cheryle Herman]

Absolutely. I know a couple of people who do that type of work specifically, simultaneous translations, and so I'm pretty sure they would be available, especially if they knew the cause, why we're trying to do this, and the importance of it.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Okay.

The idea was suggested to us by one of our witnesses, the idea of people doing translation from a remote location. Does that ever arise, or are the people who do simultaneous translation normally set up onsite? I'm not sure how it works.

Here we typically have translators who are in a translation booth. I think you can kind of see behind me on one side the edge of our translation booth. Is that the manner in which simultaneous translation is done where you are, or is it done in some different manner?

[Cheryle Herman]

The way I've seen it done has always been the way you have it set up there, where you have the translators onsite, but I don't see why it couldn't be done remotely, just as we're doing here, through video conferencing.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Okay.

The other issue that has arisen is the need for what's called a “relay language”. This is a term that comes out of the European Union where they have—I'm not sure of the number—some 18 languages that are official, or more.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

It's a higher number.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Mr. Graham says it's higher. They have a large number of languages, and it becomes a practical difficulty. I think they ran into a problem with someone who spoke both Greek and Danish, and there was some key thing where apparently no one in Europe speaks this particular set of two languages. So what they do is have a member of the European Parliament speak his or her language, then a translator translates into some widely spoken language—English, French, or German perhaps—and then it gets translated into others.

I don't know what the situation is. Obviously, people are bilingual, and Dene and English would be widespread. Are there people who also speak French with a high degree of proficiency, as well?

[Cheryle Herman]

[Technical difficulty—Editor] or aboriginal languages in general.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

I'm sorry, we lost the first part of your response. Would you repeat your response?

[Cheryle Herman]

Okay. Are you speaking to aboriginal languages?

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

I'm speaking to Dene in particular.

[Cheryle Herman]

No, we don't speak French. There might be a handful of people who are trilingual and would speak English, French, and Dene, but there are not many. We mostly speak Dene and English.

[Scott Reid, Conservative, Lanark—Frontenac—Kingston, ON]

Okay. That's very helpful. Thank you very much.

[The Chair, Liberal, Larry Bagnell]

Mr. Graham.

[David Graham, Liberal, Laurentides—Labelle, QC]

Thank you. I'll build a bit on where Scott is going.

How many translators do you think there are available today for simultaneous interpretation of Dene? Do you have a sense or a ballpark number?

[Cheryle Herman]

In our area, the area I come from, and the Far North included, I think we have three simultaneous translators.