Evidence of meeting #25 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was prorogation.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Clerk of the Committee  Mr. Justin Vaive
Andre Barnes  Committee Researcher

1:25 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

I'm glad you mentioned child care. I can't really speak to the work of your committee, and I'm not aware of the report, but it's good to hear that eventually it did move forward. I was actually going to mention this. It sort of leads into a couple of other points I wanted to make before I wrapped up.

This is from page 13 of the throne speech:

The Government will create an Action Plan for Women in the Economy to help more women get back into the workforce and to ensure a feminist, intersectional response to this pandemic and recovery.

I could go on about that, but I think it's a really important commitment that we made. Obviously, there's more work to be done.

It also states:

It has been nearly 50 years since the Royal Commission on the Status of Women outlined the necessity of child care services for women’s social and economic equality....Recognizing the urgency of this challenge, the Government will make a significant, long-term, sustained investment to create a Canada-wide early learning and childcare system.

The pandemic highlighted the “she-cession” and how the hard-fought advancement of women's equality could be set back by this pandemic. The government is committed to making not only an action plan for women in the economy, but also a national early learning and child care system. I can't tell you how passionately some of my constituents feel about that as a priority.

Again, I know that we all have different opinions on things, and that's fine. Ms. Vecchio did some very substantive work, I'm sure, in her committee that I personally would value reading and reviewing. I try to read a lot. That's why my eyes are always so red. I stay up pretty late reading. That's why I remarked earlier that I got a good sleep for once, so I feel energized for today's debate. It's important, and I hope that all members are taking care of themselves at this time.

I really value the hard work you all put in every day. I really respect all of you. I hope you're all taking the time to take care of yourselves.

I'll wrap up there for now, Madam Chair. I do have a lot more to say about this, but for now I'll hand it over to one of my honourable colleagues. I don't know who is next, but I'm sure they have lots of meaningful things to share as well.

Thank you.

1:25 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

Thank you for your remarks, Mr. Turnbull. I apologize about the interventions. Just give me a heads-up that....

You know, somehow more were encouraged than usual, or were prompted somehow, but if a member doesn't wish to go down that road, they don't have to. We don't have to use the protocol at all, really, if the committee doesn't find it helpful. It's only there to be helpful, not to actually make it worse.

I don't know what you think about that, but [Technical difficulty—Editor]

1:30 p.m.

Liberal

Stéphane Lauzon Liberal Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I would like to thank my colleague Ryan for his passion. We can't miss anything but we're here.

Thanks to everyone.

Once again, we're here to talk about the role and relevance of prorogation. My colleague frequently alluded to the throne speech and I'm also going to link it to the economic statement, which is also important. The Speech from the Throne was delivered in September, but the economic statement was in November, and the work done during prorogation is what enabled us to greatly improve things.

I'd like to return to something extremely important that was raised by my colleague Mr. Turnbull, and that affected me directly. These were the decisions we made during this difficult period with respect to seniors. My colleague spoke to us about long-term care, but there's one thing in particular I'd like to address. I'd like to speak to my colleague's comments by saying that although these matters were discussed on other committees, we, the members of the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs, also have something to say about the seniors file.

This is demonstrated by the fact that Bill C-19 includes extremely important long-term care provisions that are matters of procedure. These were part of the discussions we had with all levels of government. We worked with the provinces and territories. The government is aware of needs specific to vulnerable populations during this pandemic. We know that the vulnerable population is seniors. The government is proposing specific measures to protect the health and safety of Canadians living in long-term care centres by protecting their right to participate in the democratic process.

What seniors went through during the lockdown was unheard of. They were kept away from their families and anyone else. Today, we need to talk about their ability to exercise their democratic rights, because if there is an election, they need to be part of the process.

And if the bill were adopted, it would also give Elections Canada, the Chief Electoral Officer and electoral staff the latitude needed to make it possible for voters in long-term care centres to vote safely. This affects us directly. The committee is therefore involved in this file.

Mr. Turnbull prepared things very well, but before discussing the actions our government took during this pandemic and during the prorogation, I would like to speak about seniors, because I'm the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Seniors. I also would like to apologize for not having been here for the first hour. If I am repeating anything that my colleagues may have already mentioned, then I'm sorry. I was in the House doing my duty and defending seniors, as it happens, in connection with a debate on a Bloc Québécois motion.

For seniors, we are also planning a 13-day period during which all electoral staff could help long-term care centre residents vote safely, in compliance with public health standards. We had to discuss these standards not only with Health Canada, but several other departments as well. We are working with Elections Canada, with the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs, and with the entire House of Commons system.

This 13-day period would give electoral staff time to organize, contact the centres, make sure that no one is forgotten, specify the precise dates for safe voting and, of course, conduct the voting process itself.

The bill would also enable electoral staff to install polling stations on a number of floors or areas in the facilities, making sure that they are accessible and comply with the standards, and the needs of these vulnerable people.

It's important to pay attention to the coming waves. We've been told that we're in the second wave at the moment, but there could be a third. Some zones are “hotter” than others. Each province has introduced a classification system for the pandemic's level of severity. Many people might find themselves in a red zone as we're discussing it. It's therefore important to adjust and to take procedural steps to help our seniors in residential and long-term care facilities.

Madam Chair, I don't know if you can hear my dog barking. I'm going to have to let him out. Can you give me 10 seconds to do that? If I don't he's going to keep barking.

1:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

You need only 10 seconds, but I actually need five minutes. Is it okay if we suspend for five minutes?

1:35 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

1:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

Thank you.

We'll all be back at 1:40.

1:35 p.m.

Liberal

Stéphane Lauzon Liberal Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC

All right, let's take a five-minute health break.

I promise you that I'll be just as impassioned when I return.

1:35 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

Thank you.

1:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

The meeting is unsuspended.

Mr. Lauzon, please carry on.

February 25th, 2021 / 1:50 p.m.

Liberal

Stéphane Lauzon Liberal Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC

Karen, I just want to start by wishing a happy birthday to your husband. He's 50 years old. I reached that a few years ago.

Thank you all.

I will switch to French now. I think it's easier for me to speak in French. I can speak a little longer in French than in English.

Let's start again.

I was supporting what Mr. Turnbull said earlier, because I liked what he said about seniors. He also focused on the throne speech and the economic statement. The throne speech was in September and the economic statement in November. My view is that the Speech from the Throne is very important, because it mentions seniors.

Some of the evidence said that the throne speech had little or no impact because it wasn't really structured in a way that would allow the government to get moving again.

I also want to talk about items pertaining to our farmers, and the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada, where Mr. Arseneault is from. The Acadian reference is of interest to Mr. Arseneault.

I used to be a municipal councillor. I have therefore done business with the Federation of Canadian Municipalities, an organization for which I have a lot of respect. The federation said that further measures to assist the cultural industry would result in a more stable sharing of the web giants' revenue, and that it was committed to promoting French across Canada; it also said that the strategies mentioned in the throne speech were highly encouraging.

Since then, the throne speech has allowed us to make a great deal of progress. In a riding like mine, people are as concerned about the environment as they are about agriculture. As I mentioned yesterday, my riding is huge—5,000 square kilometres—and has 41 rural municipalities. That's what the farmers said about climate change and that's what they thought about the very welcome paragraph in the throne speech about the importance of promoting French and the plan to strengthen the Official Languages Act on the basis of the specific status of French in Canada. Everybody's involved.

We changed things in the throne speech to give recognition to our culture. There is French in Quebec, but there is also French outside Quebec, in francophone and Acadian communities, for instance. The throne speech led to the changes we are seeing today. The Montreal Chamber of Commerce told us that in cities, our economy was being driven by clean technologies, something focused on in the throne speech. That's good news for electric transportation, a strong area of expertise in my province of Quebec. It's strong in Canada too. It's a Quebec organization, the Montreal Chamber of Commerce, one of the largest Canadian chambers of commerce, that said so.

It's worth noting that what was said in the throne speech following prorogation really changed things. We have the evidence. The good news is that this Speech from the Throne promises action to combat the opioid crisis, to improve the welfare of indigenous people, and to enhance access to mental health resources to ensure that everyone can get the care they need, when they need it. This came from the Canadian Mental Health Association, the CMHA. These are all organizations recognized across Canada.

The Prime Minister's promise to compensate dairy producers, which was reiterated in the throne speech, was favourably received. We announced it in the throne speech. What have we done since? Dairy producers in my riding and my colleagues' ridings received fair and equitable compensation, approved by all of the associations that represent dairy producers in Canada.

I could go on about many more subjects, but these were concrete measures taken following a setback. I've been asked what a prorogation accomplishes and how the government will be able to bounce back. I have just given you a list of measures, and there are many others. I haven't even spoken yet about seniors. As it happens, we reiterated that we would be increasing old age security benefits for seniors 75 years and over by 10%. That, for me, is something essential.

We are working together now to deal with a pandemic and we need to slow a number of things down so that we can work on programs that will help Canadians. We all have the same financial problems, whether in businesses, the cultural sector, organizations or the general population, including seniors in long-term care centres.

Our government has adapted to better serve Canadians. It introduced programs to help the entire population. I've already said, and will continue to say, that nothing is perfect. A pandemic doesn't come with an instruction manual.

I would like to say one thing though. I've been in politics for a long time. It must be nearly 25 years. I had been a municipal councillor since 2009, and I've been a federal member of Parliament since 2015. I've never felt as useful to my fellow citizens as I have by helping those in need. That includes all my fellow citizens. I've spoken to ferryboat operators, seniors and all kinds of fellow citizens, as well as micro-enterprises with only two or three employees.

Are you aware of what we've actually done? We've saved lives. I can go that far. I will say it. I'm speaking from the heart today. We saved lives. There is a great deal of psychological distress among people today. Were you aware that money is one of the main causes of psychological distress, in second place after divorce?

Not only that, but the crisis has clearly created family tensions and we all know that the number of incident reports from centres for women in distress have increased. We're very much aware of this.

Together, we've helped the community as best we can. I know that it increases the debt and that we will have to start thinking about that very soon. I'm very much aware that we're going to have to work twice as hard. However, by supporting businesses and much of the population, we've saved many families and marriages.

During the pandemic, senior couples in need were able to receive $1,500. That's more than double the amount we had promised seniors in the 2015 election campaign, as an increase to the guaranteed income supplement. We are now prepared to consider a future increase in assistance for seniors. We are prepared to do even more to help businesses and kickstart the economy. That's why we've launched an economic recovery plan.

There was also something added to the Speech from the Throne a little later, and that was the economic statement in the fall of 2020, from which I recall a number of items. Contrary to what I've heard in some of the evidence, and in what I've read in a number of documents, it's impossible to go back quickly and declare a 24-hour prorogation under the current circumstances. If a pandemic isn't a good reason to prorogue Parliament, then I don't know what would be for a government, whether in Canada or elsewhere in the world. We've come up against a wall that nobody had anticipated.

No one could have seen this pandemic coming. It's easy to say that the government didn't react quickly enough and that it could have done this or that. I've been hearing about “should haves” all my life. With a pandemic like the one we're in, we, as parliamentarians, need to pull together to do our work in the House and in the committees, and to adopt our motions.

I'm thinking, for example, of medical assistance in dying. People are waiting for it. When I returned home from jogging one day, I saw my neighbour sitting on my porch. He was crying as he waited for me. I asked him what was going on. He wanted us to take action on medical assistance in dying, because he needed it. He has amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, or ALS, and he's going to die soon. He told me that as a great athlete and marathon runner, he needed us. He wanted us to adopt an act that had more latitude; otherwise he wouldn't be entitled to medical assistance in dying.

Right now, we're trying to get things done in the House and people are putting obstacles in our way as we try to meet the requirements of the court and to work with the provinces and territories. More than ever, it's important for us to work together and to move this issue forward. The government motion we introduced does indeed have huge implications.

Our committee has many other issues to address, and I sincerely believe that the current report on prorogation will be enough for us to move forward and submit recommendations as best we can.

I went to bed late yesterday but slept very well. I read into the small hours of the morning to learn more about the file. After all the reading I've done over the past few days I can see that there are great differences of opinion, and I respect these.

But I have more trouble accepting the idea that an opinion can be submitted with accompanying solutions even before the committee has looked at the recommendations. That bothers me. It's nevertheless there in writing. We are responsible enough and educated enough to reach decisions about what we want and don't want to see in a report. We'll debate each of the recommendations and update all the information.

I sincerely believe that we need to get to work as quickly as possible to study the very important initiatives pertaining to our democracy. I sincerely believe that we need to move forward and introduce additional motions, and deal with new projects the committee will be working on.

My colleague spoke at length about the importance of the Speech from the Throne. I'd like to speak to you about the throne speech and the economic statement. Some claimed it was nothing more than a smokescreen and that it was unnecessary. And yet, I can already see a difference in Canadians.

I can understand that Ms. Vecchio might be pleased to hear me refer to what she said and what her party argued. But I truly believe that the throne speech was incredibly important—just as important as the economic statement.

We've been living through a very difficult winter. We're tired and fed up with being shut in, even though we are at least free. Sometimes, just for a change, I hide out in my riding office, but I'm always alone at home. From time to time, my dog wants to go out. My children are gone, my wife is off to work and I'm alone. I must admit that I too feel alone. And yet, I have everything I need. I have you on screen, I have the House of Commons, I have my passion for seniors and a role as a parliamentary secretary, and so I have nothing to complain about.

But then just think about the number of seniors who are isolated and can't even leave their room. All they have is a bed, a sink, a closet and a television set. Some don't even have the Internet. I heard some evidence pointing out that some seniors couldn't even get online. Well, in my riding, they can't get the Internet because there's simply no access to it. Only 40% of the population have access.

That's why the government made a commitment. Never has a government spent as much as us to make the Internet accessible and affordable to everyone as soon as possible. I'm talking about 5G and at least 50 megabits per second. Seniors and vulnerable people need this access to break out of their isolation.

I live in the country, but I have Internet access because it's a decision I made. To be a member of Parliament, needless to say, I had to find a place where I could have access. I had not anticipated the pandemic, but I needed Internet access at home, particularly so that the children could do their schoolwork. I needed it and I found it, but that's not the case for everyone in my riding.

Our government's priority is therefore to step back and ask how we can connect to the Internet in a riding like Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation.

A highway was built right through the middle of my riding. Highway 50. As I drive it, I'm often on the telephone—needless to say I follow the rules and operate hands-free—but I lose contact four times because my cell phone loses the network connection.

This is 2021. What are our priorities? They're all important, but to break out of isolation and keep people safe, a communication system is essential. It's extremely important for our democracy and for the future we want to build for ourselves.

During the pandemic, some groups of people suffered from isolation, including seniors, but they're not alone. When I was driving on route 323 in my riding, I saw a car that seemed to be in distress at the top of a mountain. I pulled over to see if everything was all right. I could see that it was a woman and her three children, in the back seat. When I asked if I could help her, she said that there was nothing I could do except get her Internet access. She told me that she had stopped there because it was the only place where she could get the Internet so that her children could do their homework.

Really? In 2021, a mother has to drive her three children to the top of a mountain so that they can do their homework?

For me, this is a priority. There's hope, however, because the best is yet to come. The government, as it said in the economic statement and the throne speech, has a plan to help Canadians get what they need.

What's needed is connectivity, and for our seniors, it's long-term care and the national strategy on long-term care.

That's the background against which I'm speaking out on the importance of the throne speech and the economic statement so that I can explain why it's a good idea for our government and the Governor General to exercise their prerogative to prorogue Parliament for a few weeks.

Right now, we don't know exactly when or how the pandemic is going to end. We're already talking about variants and a possible third wave. We don't know where it's all headed, but we know that it will end. We've taken the steps needed to end the pandemic. The action we took stemmed from our government's decisions.

If the pandemic is not a good reason to take a step back in order to move two steps forward, then the rule should be eliminated. The prerogative to prorogue Parliament is essential for instances like the situation we've been in. No one can say that it wasn't useful.

The four committees that studied prorogation could have made all kinds of assumptions. I'm not naming names, but no one can tell us today that this prorogation was inappropriate.

The government's economic statement is clear. We were able to say afterwards that every Canadian could be vaccinated free of charge. We have a plan, and it's in place.

We're working hard, together with the suppliers and the hubs we want to create in Canada to meet future vaccination needs. Everyone knows that you can't build the plants, launch the companies and be on top of things in a week. It takes time. However, we are negotiating with other suppliers.

We have the most complete and most diversified vaccine portfolio in the world. Everyone will be able to get vaccinated. We even have access to many doses of vaccine. We have almost 430 million doses for those eligible for the vaccine. We are therefore in a good position.

The Fall Economic Statement 2020 also contained new measures for Canadians to combat the pandemic. We didn't only talk about vaccines—the vaccines are one component—we didn't only talk about long-term care and we didn't only talk about assistance to dairy producers, but that's nevertheless quite a lot.

For example, we spent money on tracing. The equipment we gave the provinces and territories cost billions of dollars. We also acquired personal protective equipment for nurses, doctors, health workers and front-line workers, in addition to rapid tests. At the moment, there are rapid tests that have not yet been used by the provinces because they have too many.

2:15 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

Sorry, Monsieur Lauzon.

Can I raise a point of order?

2:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

Sure.

2:15 p.m.

Liberal

Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON

I'm having trouble hearing. I don't know why the volume is quite low on the translation. I'm not sure if it's just me or if others are having the same issue, but I just wanted to raise it. Maybe we could check if the interpreter volume could be turned up just a little bit.

2:15 p.m.

The Clerk

Madam Chair, we can check on that.

2:15 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

Okay. Thank you, Justin.

You feel so helpless sometimes with these Zoom meetings. There's not something I can physically go and do.

While he's checking on it—and I don't know if this is appropriate—I thought it would be interesting to tell all of you about all of the people it takes to put on these meetings. I was just talking to the clerk the other day about it, because it takes more people than it usually does.

We have the interpreters, and we need more than we usually do need. We have 20-minute shifts for interpreters. We also have the proceedings and verification officer, who you usually see in the room, who switches the microphones on and off. Then we also have a control room for the webcasting, which used to be back there as well, but now in addition to that we have Zoom technicians. We have technicians who monitor everyone's connectivity, who are different from the Zoom technicians. Then we have IT ambassadors who give you the phone call if there's any kind of technical difficulty and you need help. And then, of course, we have our analysts and our fantastic clerk.

I just wanted to give them a little shout-out while we were figuring out this problem. It takes a lot of people to put on these meetings. We really appreciate all the hard work that goes on behind the scenes. Even though we don't get to see you, we know our meetings run smoothly because of your efforts, so thank you so much for that.

Hopefully, the problem is resolved. I'll hand it back to Mr. Lauzon.

2:15 p.m.

Liberal

Stéphane Lauzon Liberal Argenteuil—La Petite-Nation, QC

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I was on a roll again. Every time we talk about health care resources sent to the provinces, I feel it personally, particularly when it helps seniors. Most of them have been deeply affected by the crisis.

We can never place enough emphasis on how important it is to support the people who built this country. We're talking about our parents, our friends and our family members who are elderly and want to live at home as long as possible. We've introduced measures to help. Some seniors cohabit with their family. I'd like to take this opportunity to thank those among you who cohabit with your parents. Hats off to you.

There are also all the seniors who live in long-term care centres or in private residences. They usually receive good care, but we all saw how the long-term care system failed. That's what was most heartbreaking.

We took a set of measures to protect long-term care residents. Earlier, I spoke about the equipment we sent to the provinces and territories, but we also sent help. At the request of two provinces, Ontario and Quebec, we sent in the military and the Red Cross to help seniors and to support a failing system. We are proud of that. We should all, as federal members of Parliament, take pride in having a system that was able to provide last resort assistance. When you have to call in the armed forces, you know that it's a last resort.

I never would have thought that the military would have to come to my riding. And yet it happened, because there have been two floods in my riding since I became the federal member of Parliament, and now there's a pandemic. When I accompany the army as a member of Parliament, I can tell you that I feel like a rooster in a henhouse. I'm proud to say that the Canadian Armed Forces helped us out. That's not to say that I'm proud about the circumstances that required it. If they're there, it's because there's an extreme need, but I take pride in saying that they came to shore up the provincial system.

I'd also like to speak about the $150 million to improve ventilation in public buildings. My children were the beneficiaries of this. There's a teacher—

2:20 p.m.

Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

I have a point of order, Madam Chair.

2:20 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

Ms. Vecchio, are you having the same problem?

2:20 p.m.

Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

No, I am not having a problem. I recognize, and you indicated, that we have many great people working, and not only in the room—interpreters, clerks and the whole shemozzle—but if we go past 2:30 today there will have to be a cancellation of other meetings because of protocol.

I just wanted to bring it up, because I believe that if you look at the room, you may be able to find consensus to suspend the meeting so that we are not now interfering in the rest of the afternoon and important committees. Thank you.

2:20 p.m.

Conservative

Tom Lukiwski Conservative Moose Jaw—Lake Centre—Lanigan, SK

I have a point of clarification, Madam Chair. Are we talking about suspending or adjourning?

2:20 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

I believe Ms. Vecchio asked to seek consensus to suspend.

2:20 p.m.

Conservative

Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON

I can go for an adjournment. I don't know what the legal matters of it are, but I just look at the fact that there are some really important things going on after this. Thank you.

2:20 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal Ruby Sahota

It looks like we have consensus on that.

I wanted to say that I forgot to mention the cleaners, who also make it possible for the committee meetings to move on. Ms. Vecchio is saying that 2:30 is generally the time they need to have the room before the 3:30 meetings can start.

We will adjourn for today. We'll see you back next time.