Evidence of meeting #32 for Procedure and House Affairs in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was clause.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
Yes, I can confirm that we're planning to move G-1, which deals with these signatures. That's the intention.
Conservative
Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON
I was just going to say that I think we should go to a vote, because I know there are other matters, and I think the majority of the committee are looking at those other suggestions.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB
I'll decline to move that one for now, Madam Chair, so that we can see what happens with the government amendment.
Liberal
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
Yes, I would like to move this amendment. It basically allows for e-signatures. It enables the candidates to collect signatures through the e-signatures. It also, I believe, has the effect of waiving the requirement to have a witness for those signatures.
Conservative
Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON
First of all, I think on this one I definitely would want a recorded division. One of my concerns about this as I'm looking at it is that with electronic signatures.... I'll be honest. A couple of weeks ago I had to sign something, but they would not accept the electronic signature. How can we ensure...?
I think that those are some of the logistical concerns I have. What do electronic signatures look like? Have we discussed this? How much information has been on that? That's kind of what I want to get at. I don't recall hearing a lot about electronic signatures during this committee. Perhaps there was some testimony I did not hear at all, but how much? Perhaps the officials can share with me what they have already done on this and give us some background as well.
Thank you.
Liberal
Ryan Turnbull Liberal Whitby, ON
I want to give the officials from Elections Canada an opportunity to answer Ms. Vecchio's question, which I think is good. I think the understanding is that EC can do electronic signatures, and I'd like to ask them if they could give some detail on it.
Anne Lawson Deputy Chief Electoral Officer, Regulatory Affairs, Elections Canada
Thank you.
I would ask Mr. Roussel to take this one to talk a little bit about the existing process and what we can and can't do in the future.
Michel Roussel Deputy Chief Electoral Officer, Electoral Events and Innovation, Elections Canada
Regarding the existing process, technically electronic signatures would be acceptable from electors provided that the witness has also signed. That would be a process that may be complicated, but if a candidate or a prospective candidate had collected electronic signatures, signatures on the pages of nomination papers electronically from the elector and from the witness, it could be then uploaded to Elections Canada and then transmitted to the returning officer for verification. That process is permissible currently under the law. It is a process that is complicated.
What we've also looked at, if the witness requirement were waived, is having a system whereby electors could submit their electronic signatures on a website where they would endorse a candidate, but to develop and test that system in a manner that is comprehensive and that works would take somewhere between four and six months. This is where the thinking of Elections Canada has been up to now.
Conservative
Karen Vecchio Conservative Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON
Thank you very much.
I really do appreciate hearing from Mr. Roussel.
You're saying that for the electronic signatures they currently have something, but when you're looking at another platform or another opportunity, that's something we cannot do.
I want to talk about the witnesses, because I recall getting witness lists where we had to have the signature and it would have to be the same witness for each and every.... What does the witness look like? You're saying a witness has to be there. Would the witness also need a signature? Would that witness have to be somebody from the campaign, or would it be a third party individual?
Can you just give me some more information on that as well?
Deputy Chief Electoral Officer, Electoral Events and Innovation, Elections Canada
The witness usually is someone who's present at the moment the signature takes place. That's what's making the process relatively complex, when you think of it from the standpoint of the elector who has to be with someone who would also provide that electronic signature. It is much less complicated when the witness, someone who is present at the time of signing, is present in person.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Yes, thank you, Madam Chair.
I have basically a question of clarification for our officials from Elections Canada.
Under the powers currently granted to Elections Canada, they can accept electronic signatures provided that the witness has also signed [Technical difficulty—Editor].
I'm sorry. I don't know if that's mine or what's going on there. Maybe it was just me hearing that noise, but you have my apologies.
First of all, under the current system you can collect electronic signatures provided that the witnesses [Technical difficulty—Editor].
Liberal
The Clerk
We're trying to figure out where it's coming from. It's not completely clear yet.
Okay, apparently everything is good now.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
I'm sorry, Madam Chair. I'll try to get back to my thoughts, and it was a very simple question too, so you have my apologies.
Basically, it's just to confirm something with Elections Canada. Under the current system the electronic signatures could be collected provided the witness has also provided an electronic signature, but what Elections Canada is suggesting is that, in terms of the change envisioned in amendment G-1, it would require four to six months for Elections Canada to be able to implement that from a technological or from a nuts and bolts perspective.
I just want to confirm that's where Elections Canada is going on that.
Deputy Chief Electoral Officer, Electoral Events and Innovation, Elections Canada
I would just, for clarification's sake, note that there was a court case in Ontario during the last by-election that says electronic signatures are admissible, so that is where we are now.
What I said is that it is admissible, but it is very complex for the candidates and for the electors.
Elections Canada has not yet built a system that would decomplexify this. To decomplexify that process, it would be preferable if the witness requirement was waived, and to build that process, as I said, for the process to work fine and be tested, so that everybody trusts what is going on, we estimate it would take between six and eight months.
Conservative
John Nater Conservative Perth—Wellington, ON
Thank you. That clarifies where that comes from. I appreciate that.
