Procedure and House Affairs Committee on Dec. 5th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Good morning, colleagues.

I hope you have had a good week. Obviously, winter has come in earnest to Ottawa.

I am calling to order meeting 137 of the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs.

Witnesses, welcome back.

I think you'll recall that should you not be using your earpieces, they are to be placed on the sticker in front of you in order to protect the health and well-being of our interpreters.

Colleagues, I'm not going to read the script again about why we're here. I think I did that last time, and we understand we are here to engage in a discussion on clause-by-clause of Bill C-65.

With that, colleagues, we are going to get into it. I've read the introductory notes already, colleagues.

The first order of business is that, pursuant to Standing Order 75(1), consideration of clause 1, the short title, is postponed.

(On clause 2)

Mr. Berthold, you have the floor.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

I'd like a clarification, Mr. Chair.

I understand that we're talking about adding something to clause 2 that is related to clause 124.

What exactly is the change in clause 2?

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

Mr. Berthold, you can put the question to the officials here today.

[Luc Berthold, Conservative, Mégantic—L'Érable, QC]

That's what I intended to do.

[Rachel Pereira, Director, Electoral and Senatorial Policy Unit, Privy Council Office]

Thank you for the question.

Mr. Chair, the change is that there's a reference added to the LTC polling stations that will now be created. There's a new LTC, long-term care, regime, so those polling stations are now added to the definition of “polling station” in the act.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

We have Mr. Calkins.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

I just want some clarification on the long-term care.

During typical elections, mobile polling stations move into various facilities, various places.

What new is being added specifically with the change in Bill C-65? Is it increasing the scope of the long-term care facilities that would be potentially impacted? Are there limits on the number of residents per se? What flexibility will the returning officer have in ensuring that people in long-term care facilities actually get to participate in the electoral process? I've been in six federal elections, and inclement weather and other types of events in the past have been an obstacle as well.

Mrs. Pereira, can you specifically advise me and others here on what assurances we will have to make sure that those folks in long-term care facilities will actually be allowed to vote?

[Rachel Pereira]

Through the chair, Bill C-65 introduces new permanent polling stations within long-term care facilities. This is in addition to options that people in long-term care have. If they're able to leave the facility, they could vote on polling day like other electors. They can also vote at advance polls if they're able to leave the facility.

For those who are unable to leave, there will be polling stations set up across the country for those long-term care residents to vote. All of the procedures will be governed by existing procedures in the act that cover advance polling stations, so the management of the boxes and the opening and closing of the stations will all be governed by those rules for the residents in the care facility.

The only change to facilitate voting for those electors is that they will not need to provide their proof of residence if they are a resident in the long-term care facility. They still need to provide their identity, but that will enable those residents to vote, because they often don't have that type of proof of residence on hand. It might be with their families or elsewhere.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

If I may continue, Mr. Chair, I want to go back and touch on one of the things you said in your opening statement.

Would this clause, in certain circumstances, allow the returning officer to make an actual polling station, like on election day, for everyone to go to a long-term care facility to vote, or is it just for the residents of the facility? I wasn't clear on that. It sounded to me like long-term care facilities could be community polling stations.

[Rachel Pereira]

They're not being established as community polling stations. They are intended for long-term care residents. It's possible that an elector could go in, but they wouldn't be a resident of the facility.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

It's not meant for community polling or for advance polls.

[Rachel Pereira]

That's correct, and it won't be advertised as such.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

Okay.

What's the threshold or typical practice, then? Is every long-term care facility in Canada usually afforded this opportunity for their residents, or is there some kind of threshold or minimum required number of electors in order to justify a long-term care polling station?

[Rachel Pereira]

I will turn this question over to my colleagues at Elections Canada. They will be able to provide a response.

[Robert Sampson, General Counsel and Senior Director, Legal Services, Office of the Chief Electoral Officer]

Thank you, Mr. Chair and Mr. Calkins.

All long-term care facilities are offered a poll, although there can be rules or reasons why a particular facility does not want to welcome a polling station. For example, during the pandemic there were obvious reasons why that wasn't feasible.

The offer is there. It's part of the returning officer's job during the writ period to contact long-term care facilities and make arrangements for polls if they're desired.

[Blaine Calkins, Conservative, Red Deer—Lacombe, AB]

Do you have any information on how many long-term care facilities actually refused or did not allow long-term care facility polling stations during the 2021 election?

[Robert Sampson]

Unfortunately, I don't have that number with me. We do have a colleague who has more operational information, so we may be able to get that. If not, we'll report back to you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ben Carr]

I have Mr. Duncan next. Then I see Monsieur Berthold, and Mr. Cooper would like to lend his voice as well.

Mr. Duncan, the floor is yours.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

This is just to get some clarification. I always like to use specific examples from Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry. For long-term care, perhaps it could be Dundas Manor.

Ms. Pereira, you mentioned that if an elector or a long-term care resident of, say, Dundas Manor was able to leave, and they wanted to go and vote by special ballot or at the advance poll, they would be able to go and do that. They would be on the list as part of that. On election day, though, when it comes to that one day, the big day, would the only spot they could vote that day be at that long-term care home?

The reason I'm asking is so that we don't have an elector cast a ballot at a long-term care home and then go over to, say, the Joel Steele Community Centre, where there are polls 134 or 172 and so on. It's one spot on election day. They'll have the opportunity like everyone else.

Does that make sense?

[Trevor Knight, General Counsel, Office of the Chief Electoral Officer]

Yes, it makes sense. The answer is they're assigned to their polling station. They can only vote at their one polling station.

One thing I would say, though, is that with the proposed change to section 124, there would be a period of time when that polling day could be set up between day zero and day 13, or the 13th day before polling. That would be the polling day for that institution. They would still have the advance polling opportunities and the special ballot polling opportunities, but their polling day could be throughout that period.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

I think the reason for doing that is that a team would go to perhaps different long-term care homes on different days, not necessarily on election day itself. They would rotate around. I'm assuming the reason that change is made, and I've highlighted this a bit before in some of the questions I've asked, is the human resource aspect. If you need two or three people per long-term care home, that starts to add up, and if they can't go and work on election day, or they're doing that....

I'm assuming this is done for HR purposes so that one or a couple of teams will go to multiple sites with one special ballot box or however they do it. Is that correct?

[Rachel Pereira]

I would just add that it is also fit for purpose, that extension of days, to give those residents flexibility, given the health conditions and other limitations they may have. The returning officer can work with some of the facilities to determine the best times within that period of 12 days.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

My last question on that, as a bit of a segue, is there might be multiple days. I'll go back to Dundas Manor. It may not be just one day or four days before. They may come two or three days between 9 a.m. and noon or for a full day. What flexibility is there? Could they come multiple times during that period to that long-term care home? As opposed to 9 a.m. to 9 p.m., is it maybe more of a 9 a.m. until noon or noon to 3 p.m.? They would have the flexibility to do that as well.

[Rachel Pereira]

That's correct.

[Eric Duncan, Conservative, Stormont—Dundas—South Glengarry, ON]

Thank you.