Procedure and House Affairs Committee on May 11th, 2023

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

At the risk of repeating myself, there's no need for a briefing. The media have reported it. The information has been out there for over 12 years. So I will repeat my question. In the opinion of the witness, does she feel today that it was the right decision to allow the MP to keep his job?

[Jenni Byrne]

I don't think there's been enough information.

I'm telling you there was no briefing and there was no evidence provided. There were newspaper reports. CSIS hasn't come out and said that they briefed the Prime Minister of Canada and he ignored that information, unlike the party here.

[Christine Normandin, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

So to what extent does the witness generally believe information put out by the media?

[Jenni Byrne]

I believe what has been reported in the press regarding foreign interference in the 2019 and 2021 campaign because the Liberal government has admitted it's actually been true. The information is coming from CSIS officials, who obviously feel so concerned about what's going on in terms of the ignoring of briefings on foreign interference that they obviously feel the only course of action they have right now is to be whistle-blowers within the press.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

Thank you.

Go ahead, Mr. Green.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you very much.

Welcome to the committee, Ms. Byrne. I know that you're well adept in these spaces, so I'll put a series of questions to you in a rather rapid-fire way. I will respect the chair, but I feel that I can probably ask them in a respectful way that might not require an intervention.

Just to confirm, were you the campaign manager for Mr. Poilievre's leadership?

[Jenni Byrne]

I was a senior adviser.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Will you be the national campaign manager? Has that been announced?

[Jenni Byrne]

Is there an election coming up soon?

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Probably.

[Voices]

Oh, oh!

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

You referenced non-state actors, which I think is an important point. A point that hasn't been raised, of course, is the tens of millions of dollars that flowed into the country during the convoy.

We know that you were a senior adviser to Mr. Poilievre during that time, and we recognize Mr. Poilievre's relationship with the convoy. You referenced Ms. Lantsman. We know that Ms. Lantsman was the first MP to provide a petition calling for the end of vaccine mandates in the lead-up.

What was your advice to Mr. Poilievre to ensure that there was a firewall between the insurrectionist actions of the convoy and the leadership campaign at the time?

[Jenni Byrne]

In terms of the convoy, I believe Liberal Justice Rouleau stated that there was actually no evidence that foreign money or foreign interference was actually part of...that he found any evidence that was part of what happened in terms of the freedom convoy.

You were on the committee, so you would probably have—

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

GiveSendGo and GoSendMe put about a million dollars coming from the United States—

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

I'm sorry. Can we pause the time for a second?

Go ahead, Mr. Fergus.

[Greg Fergus, Liberal, Hull—Aylmer, QC]

I'd like to apologize to my colleague. I have a point of order.

There was a statement regarding Justice Rouleau. I think there was an adjective added by the witness. I'm just trying to figure it out. Is that a title? Because clearly it's not the case, as far as I know, that anybody who's a member of the judiciary is appointed on...or has memberships in political parties.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bardish Chagger]

I'll return the floor to Mr. Green.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

Thank you.

Let's try to keep points of order to the actual Standing Orders so that we can continue with this.

My question was against advising...at a time when $10 million is going to Tamara Lich, who's from the Maverick Party; there are close connections between senior Conservative MPs and the movement; and you have Mr. Poilievre in a leadership race that you're a senior adviser for.

I mean, it's a fact that a million dollars came in. We know that to be true. What advice would you have given Mr. Poilievre, given the close relationship to the Conservative Party and the convoy, to ensure that foreign interference did not occur?

[Jenni Byrne]

If you're talking about donations, over 62,000 people donated $9.7 million to our leadership—

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

To be specific, what advice would you be providing at this moment to the leader in the leadership race to ensure that there was no...?

Did you take any precautions? Let me just put it that way. If the answer is no, you can say no and we can move on.

[Jenni Byrne]

Precautions.... I guess the only thing you could be talking about would be fundraising, so that's what I was trying to address.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

It could also be memberships. Presumably, with the numbers that have been reported, there had been a lot of allegations during the last leadership race about inflated numbers and fake numbers. We've heard testimony from expert witnesses that nomination races are a prime place for foreign interference.

[Jenni Byrne]

It might be in other parties. I know that the Liberal Party of Canada has free membership. I'm not sure what your party has. Ours is a $15 one-year membership. People must pay by their own credit card or they must pay by a personal cheque.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

There was no advice given at that time from you, as a senior leader, to Mr. Poilievre regarding the relationship between—

[Jenni Byrne]

There are very clear Elections Canada rules regarding leadership, and there are very clear party rules regarding leadership.

In terms of the donations, as I said, over 62,000 people donated close to $9.7 million—