Evidence of meeting #3 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was cmhc.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Bayla Kolk  Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
Marie-Geneviève Mounier  Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Policy, Dispute Resolution, and International Affairs, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development
Karen Kinsley  President, Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation
Debra Darke  Director, Community Development, Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation

3:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Komarnicki

Thank you for your attention. We are going to get started.

We have with us, from the Department of Human Resources and Skills Development, the assistant deputy minister who deals with labour program compliance, operations, and program development; and the assistant deputy minister of labour program policy, dispute resolution, and international affairs.

We will have opening remarks from them. I understand they will go through a deck. Then, as usual, we will start with five-minute rounds of questioning.

Without saying too much more, I'll invite the guests to make their presentations.

3:30 p.m.

Bayla Kolk Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Thank you, Mr. Chair and committee, for the opportunity to be here today. My colleague Marie-Geneviève Mounier and I, Bayla Kolk, are the two ADMs of the labour program. Thank you for the opportunity to talk to you about our mandate, our activities, and the scope of our program.

We're going to take you through a short presentation. I believe you have all received it. We'll take the time to give you key facts, and then we will be prepared to answer your questions and have a good discussion with you.

The labour program is part of Human Resources and Skills Development Canada. We're one of three strategic business lines, along with HRSD and Service Canada, but uniquely, the labour program has its own minister, Minister Lisa Raitt, and its own deputy minister, Madame Hélène Gosselin.

On page three you have a picture of our annual budgets: in the main estimates for 2011-12, $179.8 million; a gross operating budget of $24.5 million, with approximately $58.5 million administered in statutory funding; and revenues credited to the vote amounting to $127.2 million.

That's a little complicated. Our revenues come from the government employment compensation act. Our transfer payments go to the wage earner protection program, with a small amount for grants and contributions. But we'd be happy to come back to that.

3:30 p.m.

Marie-Geneviève Mounier Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Policy, Dispute Resolution, and International Affairs, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

I would like to start by talking a little bit about the mandate of the Labour Program.

The Labour Program's mandate is to promote safe, fair and productive workplaces and cooperative workplace relations. The Labour Program delivers on its mandate through the administration and enforcement of the Canada Labour Code (CLC), which has three parts. The first part deals with labour relations.

Part I of the legislation governs industrial relations in federally regulated workplaces. It's also the part of the act that establishes the Canada Industrial Relations Board and establishes federal conciliation and mediations services, which are located within the labour program.

The second part deals with occupational health and safety, and the third part deals with labour standards.

3:35 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

As well as being rooted in the Canada Labour Code, the labour program administers and enforces the Government Employees Compensation act; the fair wages and hours of work act; the Employment Equity Act; fire protection services; and the wage earner protection act, which is part of the economic action plan.

3:35 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Policy, Dispute Resolution, and International Affairs, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Marie-Geneviève Mounier

The Labour Program operates on three levels: federal jurisdiction, national and international.

Federal jurisdiction includes many of Canada's national infrastructure industries or anything involving:

navigation, fishing, shipping, operation of ships, airports, airlines, telecommunications, banks, and most of the transport industry interprovincially.

Activities include employer-union relations where we provide mediation services, labour standards, occupational health and safety, workers' compensation, and employment equity, where the federal government has regulatory responsibility.

I would say that the federal jurisdiction, just for your information,

covers approximately 12,800 employers. Moreover, just under a million employees are covered by Part I.

Between 1997 and 2006 the average share of the GDP of firms under federal jurisdiction was 9.3%, and over the same period their contribution to GDP growth was approximately 11.6%.

3:35 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

I will turn to page 6,

which deals with the national level and our relationship with the provinces and territories.

We've said that we operate on three levels. On the national level, we are exercising leadership and coordination with provinces and territories.

In the domain of labour, this is a very collaborative mode. Our minister meets with her counterparts in provinces and territories. We have working groups related to occupational health and safety and

labour standards.

Basically, in regard to what the federal government does in our own federal jurisdiction, our provincial and territorial counterparts are doing similar activities in theirs. There's a lot to be gained from the collaboration on labour that exists throughout Canada.

I'll give you a couple of examples. During the H1N1 pandemic, we were able collectively to call in the expertise around occupational health and safety and to collectively help the Public Health Agency of Canada get the word out about the ways of operating in the workplace that were safe and healthy for employees across Canada. Another example is that we implemented legislation to protect employment of reservists, which was done in close collaboration with provinces and territories. Another example that you don't have on our page, but which I'll mention, is the anti-violence regulations that were developed with provinces and territories and are also cited as a best practice, because all of us included employers and unions in that activity to come up with excellent anti-violence regulations.

3:35 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Policy, Dispute Resolution, and International Affairs, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Marie-Geneviève Mounier

On the international stage, our objective is to protect Canadian businesses from unfair competition that could result from the laxness of existing labour standards. The Labour Program has two main thrusts: helping the International Labour Organization to develop international labour standards and developing labour cooperation agreements. Canada has signed 32 International Labour Organization conventions, including four in the past two years. We can come back to this later but, when free trade agreements are negotiated, a labour agreement is negotiated in parallel.

A little earlier, I mentioned that the Canada Labour Code

is divided into three parts. Part I is the labour relations part. It's really where we provide for dispute resolution services in support of collective bargaining for the federally regulated sector.

We do offer some professional mediation and conciliation services to assist the parties for the purposes of renewing or revising their collective agreements. Allow me to say that the interventions of the FMCS, the federal mediation and conciliation service, resulted in over 90% of all settled labour disputes being settled without a work stoppage.

The FMCS also provides preventive mediation workshops and training for businesses under federal jurisdiction.

3:40 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

I'm moving on to page 9, part II of the Canada Labour Code, which focuses on occupational health and safety.

The labour program takes both proactive and reactive approaches to occupational health and safety. We proactively deal with high-risk industries to make sure they have the education and information needed to address their safety and health concerns. And we are reactive: according to the Canada Labour Code, our health and safety officers go in to investigate accidents, fatalities, and refusals to work and we render decisions and we ensure compliance with the Canada Labour Code.

Under the Canada Labour Code the employee has three fundamental rights: the right to know about every known or foreseeable health or safety hazard in the area where they work; the right to participate in identifying and correcting job-related health and safety concerns through their representatives and committees; and the right to refuse dangerous work. And if an employee in a federally regulated workplace refuses work, that is when a health and safety officer from the labour program comes in and assesses whether there is danger and renders a decision.

It's important to note that the area of occupational health and safety is a shared responsibility. The government is the regulator, setting the norms, providing education, doing the health and safety inspections, and issuing direction, but as a shared responsibility of the employers and the employees to have their health and safety committees and to undertake to have the best they can in a healthy and safe workplace.

Our health and safety code has us covering 1.2 million workers, including the federal public service.

We recently put in place a new quality assurance framework that ensures more consistency in decision-making across the country and focuses on service delivery and service excellence. It's a very active area. For example, in 2010-11, 3,400 occupational health and safety proactive interventions were finalized and 93 hazardous occurrence investigations were initiated and 82 completed. It is a key component of our work under the Canada Labour Code.

On the next page, page 10, labour standards, we talk about healthy, fair, and productive workplaces. This is the area of fairness. What are the fair hours of work and wages? What are the fair conditions for severance and dismissal? We're very active in this area as well.

We also recover unpaid wages for employees, and approximately 1,000 unjust dismissal complaints were resolved, many of them through newer alternative dispute resolution, proactively to avoid formal lawsuits, formal complaints.

You'll notice on this page that there have been good developments in recent years on the labour standards front. We have the compassionate care leave, which is administered by HRSDC, as well as extended paternity, parental, and reservist leave.

We cover approximately 820,000 workers, accounting for 6% of all non-public-administration employees, including banks, first nations, governments, and enterprises.

On page 11 are some of the additional business lines that are related to the labour program.

The federal workers' compensation, which is our GECA, the Government Employees Compensation Act, is the area where we work very closely with provincial workers' compensation boards to make sure those who are injured in the workplace are compensated for their injury. Under this federal workers' compensation we're also very much engaged in helping people return to work appropriately. It's about prevention, support, and return to work. About 6,100 third-party claims were filed and about $1.8 million was recovered last year from workers' compensation claims.

The labour program also provides fire protection consultative services, through which we have engineers and inspectors helping across the country, those under federal jurisdiction, including first nations on reserve.

Lastly, there is the wage earner protection program. This is our new program, introduced in 2008 as part of the Government of Canada's economic action plan, which takes into account the economic fragility of the last few years by giving compensation to those who are affected by a bankruptcy. We have a cap of $3,400. It's a one-time payment, but it helps people to make that transition and adjustment to their next stage.

Since 2008, when the WEPP was implemented, 40,000 Canadians have received almost $90 million in WEPP payments.

On page 12, last but not least, there is the Employment Equity Act from 1986. The Minister of Labour has responsibility for the act, but of course it is something that every federal department and agency and those under their jurisdiction have responsibility to conform to. The Employment Equity Act is about four designated groups chosen because they have high unemployment rates and more barriers to labour market participation. The groups are women, aboriginal persons, persons with disabilities, and visible minorities.

We have three programs related to the Employment Equity Act. The first one is the legislated employment equity program requiring those under our jurisdiction to file an employment equity report and to show us they are making every effort to bring in, through an inclusive strategy, those four designated groups.

We also have the federal contractors program, whereby those who get a contract with the federal government also have to demonstrate that they are taking seriously their employment equity commitments.

Lastly, the racism-free workplace strategy helps us work in partnerships with groups such as the Aboriginal Human Resource Council, the National Film Board, and the Metropolis Secretariat run out of Citizenship and Immigration Canada to promote the benefits of inclusion in the workplace.

It's not only about doing the right thing; it's also to try to help workplaces see that there are benefits to productivity. As you probably know, the Canadian workforce before long is going to have its growth in two groups: new immigrants and aboriginal persons. We try to promote the benefits of inclusion and not just the barriers that are being faced.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Komarnicki

Could you please wrap up?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

We're finished. Thank you.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Ed Komarnicki

Thank you very much for your presentation.

I'll open it up to questions, starting with Ms. Crowder.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

Thank you.

Thank you very much for coming before the committee today. You have a complicated department.

I'm not actually sure this falls under your purview. I'm going to ask the question, and you can tell me if it's outside the scope of what you do. When you're talking about legislated employment equity, I think you're probably aware that back in 2009 a change was made to pay equity, so that the pay equity complaints are now heard by the Public Service Labour Relations Board. Are you involved in that?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

We are not involved in that. As far as I know, that would be the Canadian Human Rights Commission and Treasury Board. We're not able to answer questions on pay equity today.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

Okay. It's actually no longer the Canadian Human Rights Commission. The Public Service Labour Relations Board now hears pay equity complaints. That's okay. That's outside the scope of what you're presenting.

I have a question on the wage earner protection program. You indicated that for 40,000 workers, $90 million has been paid out to date. Are you aware of any applicants who were turned down, and if so, how many and for what reasons?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

Some applicants are turned down. I don't have the number with me today. The approval rate is quite high. In fact, over 57% reach the cap of $3,400. There are a few reasons applicants are turned down. For one thing, they may have received payments, severance pay, or payments from trustees or from another source. If there is payment from another source, WEPP will not apply.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

Even if it's not fully the severance pay and wages? If they receive a portion, would you cover a portion of it?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

If the amount that they have received is $3,400, we would not pay. If they had received, let's say, $1,000 and they still qualified--and I'll get to how to qualify--then they are likely to get the difference.

Also, we are seeing that some apply too late, and it has to be that you're affected within six months of the bankruptcy of the company. If you lost your job before that, and it's really not related to the bankruptcy, that would be another reason for being rejected.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

From date of application to receipt of payment.

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

Pardon me?

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

The processing time is from date of application to receipt of payment?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

That I would have to get for you. We're responsible for the program development and guidance, and the service delivery is Service Canada, who you met with last week. But we can get the service standards and the rate of payment for you.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

Are you involved in workforce adjustment for the public service? For example, we've heard of potential lay-offs within the employment insurance processing. Are you involved in the workforce adjustment piece of that?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

No. That would be handled by the department responsible for employment insurance.

3:50 p.m.

NDP

Jean Crowder NDP Nanaimo—Cowichan, BC

You mentioned on page 6 of your deck--it was an addition, I believe--anti-violence regulations. Can you say a little bit more about that? Is that violence in the workplace? Is that setting standards?

3:50 p.m.

Assistant Deputy Minister, Labour Program, Compliance, Operations and Program Development, Department of Human Resources and Skills Development

Bayla Kolk

Yes. A few years ago, in 2008, we developed anti-violence regulations. Now many organizations are taking these regulations—HRSD did this—and establishing anti-violence policies within their organization. What it is about really is identifying what violence is in the workplace. It is not only physical violence; it can be threats and harassment. And then what are the strategies for the employer to counter this?

In recent years there's been a lot of emphasis put on bullying and harassment. This is a contribution to that area, a statement by the government that there are ways to counter this. We also link it to mental health issues of how to create a healthy and productive workplace.