Evidence of meeting #101 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was essential.
A recording is available from Parliament.
Acting Director, Corporate Labour Relations, Correctional Service of Canada
I couldn't give you exact numbers, but certainly the reports are that occupational stress-related incidents or injuries is high amongst correctional officers.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
When the legislation, going back to 2013, was taken away, how did that impact your members?
You're already in a stressful situation. We've heard from other witnesses that when they go to work it feels as if they don't want them there because they are making it even harder for them to be there.
Did it make it harder for them to work there?
Acting Director, Corporate Labour Relations, Correctional Service of Canada
I don't know that it made it harder for them to work there. CSC's work in the community is difficult. Whether or not it made it more difficult to work there I wouldn't be able to say. That being said, we all recognize that the work they do in institutions and in communities is important, and it's not easy.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
When we hear comments that absenteeism might be higher, or we're doing the quote thing, and pointing fingers and saying that the system allows people to take more than what they have earned or deserve, to me it would be very frustrating.
When we talk about the removal of the dispute resolution, can you tell us a little about how that impacts your members now, or how it will?
Acting Director, Corporate Labour Relations, Correctional Service of Canada
The positions of the union of Canadian correctional officers within the bargaining unit were designated 100% essential. We still have an agreement in principle to that effect. The previous regime made it so they were on the arbitration road, and historically they would have selected the conciliation strike road, although they recognize they wouldn't have the ability to strike.
If this bill is passed, they will be able to return to what they would previously have selected as a resolution method.
Acting Director, Corporate Labour Relations, Correctional Service of Canada
I'm sure there were frustrations on their side. I couldn't speak for them. They would have likely chosen another dispute resolution mechanism.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
When you say they were designated an essential service, what's the difference between essential and non-essential?
Acting Director, Corporate Labour Relations, Correctional Service of Canada
Essential work would be contributions to the security and safety of the public. The work they do, direct custody care, control of inmate population, clearly has a direct impact on security. Therefore, that's why they would be designated as essential.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
Okay.
Mr. Thibodeau, let me ask you the same thing.
Is border security a hard business to be in?
Director General, Labour Relations and Compensation, Canada Border Services Agency
It is challenging.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
How do you think this legislation would affect your members?
Director General, Labour Relations and Compensation, Canada Border Services Agency
Regarding the current level of designation of essential services for the FB bargaining unit, the border services officers are currently at 75%. From that perspective, whether you're operating under the previous, the current, or the proposed new, they would have access to a conciliation strike. However, the 75% was close to the rule of 80%. If that was to disappear, they would probably remain on the conciliation strike route, which has historically been their choice as well. Those are two distinct elements.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
Previously when they took away the sick leave, how did that impact your members?
Director General, Labour Relations and Compensation, Canada Border Services Agency
That proposal came forward. I have not been able to statistically quantify the impact from the perspective of the usage of sick leave. It was an element that was raised in various union-management discussions at the departmental level. It was a proposal in bargaining, and colleagues from the TBS can articulate the impact from that perspective.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
Okay. Thank you.
Mr. Bowlby, are there any statistics from StatsCan that show prior information on sick leave? Are we tracking those sorts of things?
Director General, Collection and Regional Services Branch, Census, Operations and Informatics Field, Statistics Canada
Sure.
Are you referring to sick leave within StatsCan or sick leave for the public service as a whole?
Director General, Collection and Regional Services Branch, Census, Operations and Informatics Field, Statistics Canada
There's some information from the labour force survey. I do not have it with me today, but we could provide it to you.
Liberal
Dan Ruimy Liberal Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
Yes, that would be great if you could provide it. Thank you.
Conservative
Mark Warawa Conservative Langley—Aldergrove, BC
My apologies for interrupting. I didn't want to interrupt during the questioning, but some of the questioning is focusing, I think, outside the lines of what the people here today are responsible for reporting to our committee. A week ago, Chair, the people were representing the unions primarily. The people who are here today represent the different departments. They're non-partisan. They represent the department, so if we were to ask them how the union members and public employees felt about this, that would have been a good question last week. However, to ask questions like that this week is out of the expertise and the responsibilities of the people there.
I just bring that as a caution, that we focus on the responsibilities of the people before us.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Bryan May
Thank you. I'm not sure that's a point of order, but I take your meaning.
As you know, I tend to give both sides a lot of latitude when it comes to their relevance, but I will keep that in mind moving forward.
Thank you, Mr. Warawa.
Sorry, Madam Trudel, please go ahead.
NDP
Karine Trudel NDP Jonquière, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I hope my questions will make sense.
Thank you very much for joining us today in committee. It is a pleasure to hear from you.
My first question goes to Mr. Thibodeau and deals with the dispute resolution process. However, if anyone else wants to answer afterwards, I would also welcome their comments.
What are the pros and cons of using conciliation rather than arbitration?