Human Resources Committee on May 7th, 2019

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Thank you.

Moving over to maybe a similar issue, I found this one quite interesting, as there is a very big difference in where this is expected to go. On the cost of supporting the program, I'm seeing that for administration, the bureaucracy that's involved with administering the program, budget 2019 again has the total cost to be about $98 million, but the PBO cost estimate says it's actually going to be a profit or revenue generator of $81 million. I don't know a lot of programs that actually make us money, especially if it's a grant. Is there any reason for that?

I just thought that was a really strange number, that this might be put forward as revenue generator.

[Graham Flack]

We are definitely not anticipating that it's going to be a revenue generator.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

I figured that.

[Graham Flack]

However, we can follow up with the PBO.

There are two pieces. There's the grant piece, and then there is the EI premium piece. The department's focus will be on the EI piece, which is how individuals will have parts of their salary covered during the period they take the training. The grant itself will be delivered through the Canada Revenue Agency.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

Yes. It looks as though the numbers on the EI training support costs in the budget are at $1.2 billion, while the PBO has it at $642 million, a big discrepancy in terms of what the cost of EI training support is going to be.

[Graham Flack]

Again, I think that will be linked to uptake. We all make estimates on what the uptake of a new program is going to be. We are always wrong on the estimates of the uptake, sometimes on the high side and sometimes on the low side. As you had highlighted in your original question, this is a new area for the government, so we don't have really good understanding of what the uptake is going to be. That will affect the draw on the EI account. The more people who take it, the higher the cost will be.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

On that point, there was mention in the budget as well of an EI small business premium rebate for business owners, who have voiced some concern that they are going to have to cover the costs of the four weeks of paid leave with this program. However, there's no mention of what that rebate will be or how it will be allocated. Can you maybe explain? Are there some numbers that will go with that, that business owners know they will be able to access, and what will that number be?

[Graham Flack]

It's the same definition we use for small business for other premium rebates. In this case, where the small business has premiums of $20,000 or less that they pay into the EI system, they will not be subject to this. That's the threshold. If they're paying less than $20,000 in premiums, they get a rebate on that as a result.

[John Barlow, Conservative, Foothills, AB]

With that, the last question I have is the other concern we are hearing from business owners, that there are no metrics or way of measuring, if I'm a welding company and I have an employee who wants to go for some additional training, I'm expecting he will maybe take pressure B welding or something along that line, but he goes and takes a culinary arts program. It doesn't help my business, yet I'm paying for his four weeks of paid leave, not to mention that he has left my operation. He comes back and it's not helping me.

What type of stipulation, guidelines or metrics would there be to ensure that if I, as a business owner, am supporting my employee to take part in this program, he or she will actually take a program that benefits me as the business owner?

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Respond briefly, please.

[Graham Flack]

The first point is that the employer will not be required to provide paid leave. The leave will be paid out of the EI account. It's not that the employers themselves are going to have to be subsidizing the leave from their payroll while the individual isn't there.

We are consulting with training institutions, employers and labour right now on the program design because it won't kick in until the end of 2020, so those are important questions you're raising.

I would say that the philosophy behind the account is that the training benefit accrues to the individual, and that, in a world where work is becoming more precarious, the individual may be choosing to upgrade their skills to do something different. The “something different” could be within the company, such as moving from one position to a different position in the company that requires different work. In principle, it could also see them moving from an employer where they're, say, in a minimum wage job at Tim Hortons, and they want to move to a different stream.

That's something we'll be dealing with in the consultations, but philosophically the trainee is not restricted to exactly what they're doing now or what their employer covers.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bryan May]

Thank you.

Up next, we have MP Long, please.

[Wayne Long, Liberal, Saint John—Rothesay, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you to everyone coming in this afternoon.

Mr. Robidoux, Minister Qualtrough was in and we were talking about Bill C-81. I was wondering, can you elaborate on the progress that has been made on the preconsultation phase so far?

[Benoît Robidoux]

I will ask my colleague Chantal Maheu to answer that question. I think she's more able than me to answer that question.

[Chantal Maheu]

Are you asking about the preconsultation on the standards?

[Wayne Long, Liberal, Saint John—Rothesay, NB]

Yes.

[Chantal Maheu]

We've just begun those discussions and this outreach. As you are aware, we are fully supporting the legislation being considered in the Senate. We're also engaged in the staffing for the key position to support CASDO and the accessibility officers.

In terms of the preconsultation, we've engaged with stakeholder organizations to identify which areas they see as priorities and to begin that discussion that would inform the work that CASDO will do once it's established.

It's early discussions, but it is all to prepare for when Bill C-81 has received royal assent, so that CASDO is in a position to start its work immediately.

[Wayne Long, Liberal, Saint John—Rothesay, NB]

With respect to the CASDO board appointment process, can you give us an update there? Are there any new developments on that?

[Chantal Maheu]

The notice of the positions has been posted. I think it closed about a week ago. We are now reviewing candidates and we're hoping to be in a position to appoint people once the bill has received royal assent.

Obviously, we cannot proceed with appointments until the organization is created, and that will require legislation. We are doing the work so that we're in a position to move with these appointments.

[Wayne Long, Liberal, Saint John—Rothesay, NB]

Are you able to give us any insight or elaborate at all on the application process? Did it exceed...? Did you have lots of applicants? Were you looking for a more diverse...?

[Chantal Maheu]

It was posted in the other GIC appointments in an accessible manner, obviously. We did outreach with stakeholder organizations and other interested parties where we thought there could be good talent. We feel very comfortable that we have a good set of talented individuals who have put their names forward.

[Wayne Long, Liberal, Saint John—Rothesay, NB]

Thank you.

This is for whoever wants to take it. The 2019-20 main estimates set aside new money for persons with intellectual disabilities, autism spectrum disorders, Canadians with visual impairments and other print disabilities.

How were these specific groups chosen to receive dedicated funding apart from the larger disability community?

[Chantal Maheu]

In terms of supporting employment for persons with intellectual disability including people who suffer from autism spectrum disorders, the funding would be provided to the Canadian Association for Community Living in partnership with the Canadian Autism Spectrum Disorder Association for the continuation of the initiative that's called Ready, Willing and Able. This initiative was funded as a continuation of investment that started in 2014. We have been investing in that initiative that really does outreach to employers to encourage them and prepare them to hire people with intellectual disabilities. The proposal has been successful in doing that and the budget has continued that funding.

I think you also asked about the funding for persons with visual impairments and the blind.

[Wayne Long, Liberal, Saint John—Rothesay, NB]

Yes.

[Chantal Maheu]

There are two elements to that funding. There is $1 million for CNIB that will be focused on supporting small businesses and hiring people who are visually impaired. There is $500,000 for doing more work on improving the accessibility of payment terminals.