Evidence of meeting #42 for Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was winnipeg.
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
Wayne Long Liberal Saint John—Rothesay, NB
Thanks.
I was going to get to you afterwards, Mr. Brandon, but go ahead and jump in.
10:55 a.m.
Community Animator, Social Planning Council of Winnipeg
I wanted to jump in about innovation, because here in Manitoba there are some really good models of that, as well as CAHRD, which Diane was talking about. There are some really interesting, innovative social enterprises, like BUILD and the Brandon energy efficiency program.
10:55 a.m.
Liberal
Wayne Long Liberal Saint John—Rothesay, NB
If you don't mind, just hold that thought. I have a few rounds here, so I want to get to you on that.
I'll go back to Ms. Redsky. Can you talk about early learning and what initiatives have happened in your community with respect to early learning? How important do you feel a national early learning program would be, to pull those children out of poverty? Does your community also offer parallel programs to parents at the same time? Certainly, one thing we hear a lot is that parents want to help. They just don't know how to help. Can you comment on that?
10:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
I would say they are excluded from helping.
10:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
We create systems within our school system that don't always encourage parental involvement.
Leading up to that, just in context, I would say that another program the Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre operates that has been very successful nationally and well evaluated is aboriginal head start. That's an early learning program for children two to five. They end up speaking three languages before they get to kindergarten.
10:55 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
It's the aboriginal head start program.
We are finding that the problem is.... It has high parental involvement. We get the families engaged, and then the kids are speaking three languages. They're ready for kindergarten, and they know all their stuff. Then they get to school, and by grade 2 it stops. The parents are not as welcome anymore. It's a system in itself, the education system. There is that transition, and it's really difficult for parents to continue to be engaged in their children's lives, so they drop off. That affects children's learning at that point.
11 a.m.
Liberal
11 a.m.
NDP
Niki Ashton NDP Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB
Thank you very much, Ms. Redsky, Mr. Brandon, for your very important presentations today.
The central point here is that we're looking for some very clear recommendations on what the federal government needs to do. While obviously there's no question that there need to be the intangibles of support in making systems more efficient, etc., what we're hearing consistently is the need for resources.
Mr. Brandon, you pointed to the fact that the federal government has been retreating from housing for decades. I certainly would love to hear your thoughts on the importance of the federal government stepping up with resources and our not minimizing the importance of that point.
I want to get your thoughts about that, Ms. Redsky, because I know, Mr. Brandon, you touched on it. Given the people, the families you work with, how important is it for the federal government to invest in housing on reserve? How is that connected to the kind of poverty you see here in the city? Obviously I'm thinking of communities up north and people I know, and the fact that many people come to Winnipeg not because they have something better lined up but because they know some people and there's some sense that they'll be able to survive.
How important would it be for the federal government to simply step up with resources on that front?
11 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
Yes, recently it does feel as if the federal government is stepping up.
There are consultations like this, but there is that sense within the community that there's more opportunity for funding programs and for engagements, etc. I think some good first steps have happened. We are watching and waiting, and are ready to jump on when that happens.
Absolutely, there's a connection between housing on reserve and why people migrate to Winnipeg when there's a lack of opportunity within first nations or it's completely unsafe to live in those situations, so it's extremely important. We are people who are connected to our land base, and that's important to us. To be able to go back home is really important. To invest in housing on reserve is a smart investment. People are not going to leave. If you don't pay attention to it now we'll be paying for all of it later.
At some point we have to get off this roller coaster, the cycle that we're in whereby our community continues to be neglected. We can't expect things to get any better if we're not making strategic investments in social development, housing, and indigenous leadership, etc.
11 a.m.
NDP
Niki Ashton NDP Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB
That's great. Thank you very much, Ms. Redsky.
Mr. Brandon, in your presentation, you briefly touched on the role of CMHC. Again, because we're here to take direct recommendations at the federal level, how important is it for members of the Social Planning Council to see CMHC fulfill its mandate?
We heard in a previous presentation that significant profits have certainly accrued when the commitment should be on investing that money and creating housing, and as you pointed out, social housing.
11 a.m.
Community Animator, Social Planning Council of Winnipeg
Housing is a critical federal function. CMHC was created after the Second World War to deal with a significant housing crisis at that time. Over the subsequent 30 years, from the sixties through to the 1980s, there was a real strong investment from CMHC into building one of the most enviable social housing systems in the world here in Canada. We built over 600,000 units of social housing right across the country. That number hasn't increased since the 1980s, and in fact it has started to deteriorate. As the operating agreements have come due, we're seeing a decline in social housing across the country, even as need is increasing.
Middle-income people struggling to afford housing, as well as wealthier Canadians, have all put into CMHC through the insurance program and through different ways. When they do that, they expect that money is going to feed back into social housing and into affordable housing, and into a complete housing system, because they know that the next generation is going to need help getting their foot in the door.
I think Canadians want to contribute to create a complete housing system. That's why we have the system in place. That's why we have CMHC in place. However, when CMHC in its annual reports pats itself on the back, saying, “You know, we've contributed $18 billion over 10 years towards deficit reduction”, it's not fulfilling that prime mandate that Canadians expect it to fulfill. If it gets back to that, we can have a robust housing system again here in Canada.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Anju Dhillon Liberal Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, QC
Good morning. Thank you for being here with us.
My question is for Ms. Redsky.
What do you think is needed to break out of this vicious cycle of poverty, in your opinion, from what you've seen?
11:05 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
I think in practical terms, it's an opportunity to have some leaders across the country, our provincial, regional or something, really rolling up their sleeves to make changes and recommendations within their regions that are going to make huge differences.
I don't want to answer that in a grandiose kind of way, “If you change the system everything will be better”. I think engagement with the indigenous community in a meaningful and direct way, where we're engaged and involved and part of the solution making, is where you will see some concrete ideas and concrete ways in which we can address poverty that is specific to our territories.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Anju Dhillon Liberal Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, QC
You mentioned before that even if the young people get trade diplomas or the training, they still won't get jobs because of who they are, because of their backgrounds.
How do you think we can overcome this kind of discrimination?
11:05 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
We're doing that at our local level, for example, with the trades. We are bringing the trades into schools. They are doing some soft education and awareness, and getting kids excited about being in the trades, while at the same time they're understanding more about the sector.
Indigenous people are the largest growing population in Winnipeg, yet they're not represented in jobs in the service industry—anywhere. We're starting to create those opportunities to get younger people, like grades 5 or 6, excited about trades, and to have the trades not be so scared about, for whatever reason, including indigenous people in the trades.
It boils down to relationship building and being proactive, so there are some local initiatives that are under way to address that. A few years from now, we should be seeing a shift and seeing more and more indigenous youth in all areas of employment.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Anju Dhillon Liberal Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, QC
What would you like to see as part of the poverty reduction strategy?
11:05 a.m.
Executive Director, Ma Mawi Wi Chi Itata Centre Inc.
We need a voice, a clear meaningful voice for indigenous people. We need to be sitting at the table—working, making recommendations, and taking the lead.
11:05 a.m.
Liberal
Anju Dhillon Liberal Dorval—Lachine—LaSalle, QC
Mr. Brandon, you mentioned that housing is the largest expense for people living in poverty, that it's at the top of the list. You spoke about flooding and people coming to Winnipeg, and you said they need supports. What kinds of supports are you talking about?
11:05 a.m.
Community Animator, Social Planning Council of Winnipeg
A lot of people coming to Winnipeg for the first time don't have experience with rental markets, so they don't necessarily know their rights as tenants. Some people don't have the identification they need to access social services. If you're coming from a smaller community, which most first nation reserve communities are, you go to the band office and you're able to get your resources all in one place.
Here in Winnipeg you're going through a number of different systems. You may be trying to access social assistance or to find employment. You may be looking for a different agency to help you with housing or with family issues. You're trying to navigate all these different systems, and there isn't a central resource for people sometimes. This can be an intimidating factor as well. Then there are factors of discrimination. If you're trying to find housing and you're indigenous, how often is it that people are discriminated against? Unfortunately, it's far too often here in Winnipeg.
11:10 a.m.
Liberal
11:10 a.m.
Community Animator, Social Planning Council of Winnipeg
I mean turned away or taken advantage of. We heard one report of a family being met at the airport by a potential landlord who got them to sign an agreement without even seeing the apartment, which turned out to be not very liveable. People are getting taken advantage of in those sorts of ways.
