Human Resources Committee on June 17th, 2021

[Leah Gazan, NDP, Winnipeg Centre, MB]

Yes, I agree. Going beyond just guaranteed income, I think we need to make sure that it's livable and accounts for regional differences as well.

Getting back to income, in the 2021 budget implementation bill, the government proposed providing a one-time payment of $500 in August 2021 to OAS for those 75 years of age or older, and increasing OAS for individuals 75 years of age or older by 10% as of July 2022.

My particular concern relates to women. Many women don't have pensions, because they worked their whole life, for example, as caregivers. Many women are living in poverty as they age.

To both of you, do you have an idea as to why the government has excluded seniors aged 65 to 74 from an increase to OAS?

Maybe I can put that question to you, Mr. Séguin.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

I would ask you to answer the question briefly, Mr. Séguin.

[Serge Séguin]

Of course.

We'd really like to know. The only answer we've received is that 65‑year-olds are better off than 75‑year-olds.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Mr. Séguin.

Thank you, Ms. Gazan.

Next we're going to go to Mr. Tochor, please, for five minutes.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Thank you very much.

Thank you to our witnesses.

We were talking about the unfairness of some of the decisions about age 75, making the cut-off lower, or not having a cut-off for seniors, which I would agree with. It is unfair.

At the start of the pandemic, we knew that seniors were going to be the unfortunate target of this virus. After we turn the corner and in the years to come, we'll look back at some of the decisions we made. It's not about pointing fingers, but we should have bubble-wrapped our seniors. The seniors were the ones who were going to be affected the most by this virus. I don't think we've done enough for seniors.

Ms. Newman, you remind me of my mom, a lot. I appreciate your testimony so much, with your straight-shooter demeanour. I very much appreciate it. I'm from Saskatoon. I've spent a fair bit of time in Winnipeg. I'm a prairie boy, as well. Some of the struggles we have out here are probably very similar to those in Manitoba.

Can you expand a bit on your awareness of the differences in care during this pandemic in rural Manitoba versus in Winnipeg, where I believe you live?

[Connie Newman]

There is a big difference. Between access to care in urban Winnipeg, Regina or Saskatoon versus access in rural areas, the difference is like night and day. That's why I'm a real proponent of our support coordinators, who are all over this province. We have more than 103 of them in various communities throughout the province. They're the go-to; they're the people who have a group of seniors, and because they're in rural Manitoba, everybody knows everybody else. They knew to go and check on Mrs. Smith, Mr. Jones, etc.

The biggest thing is, when we went into shutdown.... Home care has a set of rules. There are many people in rural and remote Manitoba who have no family. First, they were left in destitute situations, partly because nobody knew. Second, they were afraid, because they weren't all that healthy to begin with. How do they get to testing? How do they get to their vaccines? If it weren't for our support coordinators out there, I'm not sure that we would be where we are today with vaccinations. There's still a problem there, and I need to deal with it after I finish with this.

It goes back to communication and who knows what out there. To me, it's a big one.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

You spoke about vaccines and that's the next thing you're turning to. I think it has been well documented that delaying second doses is prolonging the restrictions out there. Have you heard any stories from Manitoba on the deliveries of vaccines? We all get that it's delayed getting into Canada, but are there any creative programs running right now in Manitoba to get seniors vaccinated in rural or urban areas that you can share with the committee?

[Connie Newman]

The short answer is no. I don't know that there are any creative programs, because what I hear is when people get into trouble. They will phone me and say, “Connie, what do I do about...?” or “Mrs. Smith is living in a.... How does she get to a vaccine site?” I communicate and I connect, so I know which button to push to solve that problem.

We all—including everybody on this line—need to understand that as we age, we become more isolated. Our friends pass away; we're disconnected; family is not there and we don't know who to call.

One of the friends I referred to has a son in New Zealand, so every now and then I get the phone call because his mother is in a personal care home. When you go to rural Manitoba, the need for community connection is huge. We know that if a small town in Manitoba is having a fair, everybody is there. Everybody knows each other.

That same thing happens across Canada. We haven't done fairs and events. My favourite, even in Winnipeg or if you go to rural Manitoba, is to ask, “Where are all the trucks?” All the trucks will be by the coffee shop, and that's where communication happens. That set of trucks takes care of everybody, and that is sadly missing. Here we go again: We don't have Wi-fi to connect those people when they can't connect themselves.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Yes.

I will just briefly wrap up, Mr. Chair, I know I'm running out of time.

As a Conservative, I support equal access to the Internet, and you'd find an ally in me as an MP for that. The Blue Bombers are only going to be Grey Cup champs for a few more months, so enjoy that.

[Connie Newman]

Oh, oh! That's what you think.

[Corey Tochor, Conservative, Saskatoon—University, SK]

Yes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Mr. Tochor.

Next is Mr. Dong, please, for five minutes.

[Han Dong, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

Thank you very much, Chair.

I want to thank both panellists for spending time with us this afternoon and offering us great insights and perspectives on the challenges that lie in front of us right now.

First of all, I absolutely agree with you that access to the Internet is essential. We've seen our senior population utilize that technology to stay connected with the world, with the outside, with the community and with their loved ones.

I have a story to share myself. Both my parents are turning 75, and my mom has always been afraid of technology. With the advancements, she had a minimal interest in digital technology. However, I've seen her evolve, and she's now using different apps. Other than out of necessity, much of that has been influenced by her friends.

[Connie Newman]

Yes.

[Han Dong, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

She's a very active member of her local community centre, and they did morning exercises every day before the pandemic hit. They find ways to connect, so access to the Internet is absolutely essential. I agree with you.

The other thing I want to share with you is that I represent a Toronto riding, North York. It's in Toronto, but it's a very settled, mature community. You have various seniors groups coming together to support each other. I've seen a lot of inspiring leadership coming out of facing the challenges.

I can say that I personally helped three groups in their applications by giving them some guidance and information about the new horizons program, which has seen a huge increase during the pandemic. They took advantage of it. They brought those classes online—just like you said—keeping the recreational activities high.

To both panellists, what's your experience with or what have you heard about communities using the new horizons program during the pandemic?

We'll start with Monsieur Séguin. He's been quite quiet for some time.

[Serge Séguin]

Thank you very much, Mr. Dong.

I couldn't say whether that program's been used. There's usually a call for projects, but we haven't seen any in Quebec during the pandemic. Normally, when the federal government issues a call for projects for seniors, a lot of Quebec agencies submit proposals. Even our association has previously submitted proposals to the federal government to develop various activities for seniors.

I don't know the situation in other provinces, but we were confined and we teleworked in Quebec during the pandemic. It was more difficult because we couldn't see each other. Our sections are nevertheless still working with seniors by telephone or videoconference.

As Ms. Newman said, the major problem is a lack of Internet access for seniors in all regions of Canada. While we don't have that problem in urban centres, in rural regions, either there's no Internet or it's low-speed access, which is hardly any better. It's better not have any access at all than to have low-speed access. The telecommunications companies, Bell and others, don't want to expand the network because it costs too much and isn't profitable.

[Han Dong, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Séguin.

I want to get Ms. Newman's feedback on the new horizons program.

[Connie Newman]

“Keep them coming” is the short answer.

[Han Dong, Liberal, Don Valley North, ON]

I love that.

[Connie Newman]

I've been part of a team on an older Winnipeggers' social engagement project for five years now in new horizons. It's been excellent in bringing five organizations together to collaborate and work together for low-income seniors in Winnipeg. We also received, in this last call, money for an age-friendly resource team on how to mobilize communities on communication.

I would say to keep them coming. My big thing is that you want older adults to fill them in and to be part of it. It's a good thing that I'm an older adult and can fill them in on behalf of our team. Some groups don't have that expertise, and it's a difficult application to fill out.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sean Casey]

Thank you, Ms. Newman and Mr. Dong.

Ms. Chabot, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Louise Chabot, Bloc, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm going to ask a quick question, then give both witnesses a chance to answer it.

We're obviously conducting this study on seniors in order to take stock of the situation. We know that seniors were hit hard by the pandemic, from financial, health and social standpoints. As parliamentarians, we're trying to determine what programs should be enhanced and what solutions put forward so we can considerably improve the living conditions of our seniors.

I'll let you answer that, Mr. Séguin.

[Serge Séguin]

It would be very helpful if the federal government, regardless of the party in power, could understand that 65‑year-olds are in as much financial difficulty as 75‑year-olds. I don't see why seniors should be divided into two citizen classes.

[Louise Chabot, Bloc, Thérèse-De Blainville, QC]

Thank you.

Ms. Newman, I heard your remarks about the Internet. You're right. In 2021, there are still Internet access problems in Quebec and elsewhere in Canada, in both rural and urban areas.

[Connie Newman]

In terms of solutions, all three levels of government need to work together to get the Internet and Wi-Fi aspect across this country solved. To me, from a Government of Canada point of view, human rights, equal aspects and equal access to information are paramount. All three levels of government have a variety of programs looking after a variety of ages, but if we don't know about them, how do we access them? To me, that's huge.