Human Resources Committee on Feb. 9th, 2026

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Mr. Genuis.

Ms. Desrochers, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Caroline Desrochers, Liberal, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

What we have today is, again, a clear illustration of the Conservatives' plans. Actually, it's a clear illustration that the Conservatives have no plans, other than obstructing everything the government is putting forward. We have seen this earlier today with the national school food program. We are seeing it every day on affordability. We are seeing it with tough on crime legislation.

They are saying they want to work together and, yet, in committee they're blocking and misinterpreting—

[Laila Goodridge, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB]

I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Clearly state your point of order.

[Laila Goodridge, Conservative, Fort McMurray—Cold Lake, AB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

It is very clear that we cannot work collaboratively if we do not receive the motion in advance.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Madam Goodridge.

That is not a point of order.

Madame Desrochers, you have the floor.

[Caroline Desrochers, Liberal, Trois-Rivières, QC]

We are here today to discuss Bill C-15. All of the elements I'm talking about, and many of which are in Bill C-15, we are seeing every day in the House. There are questions about affordability. Yet, when it comes time to support the initiatives we are putting forward, like the national school food program, the dental care plan and the child care benefit, the Conservatives stand up and vote no.

Here we are discussing the budget implementation act, Bill C-15.

Thank you very much, Ms. Joomun, for your testimony today. I hear your concern. I want to present what we are putting forward, just to clarify. I am hearing concerns. We are after students who attend private, for-profit educational institutions outside Canada. We are not looking to claw back on programs in Canada, unless the provincial government is making a recommendation that the institution does not necessarily provide the services it should provide.

We are here, again, in this world of building a big monster and the Liberals broke everything. That's in theory, of course. There are no credible plans that you are putting forward that we can actually work with.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

It's the budget.

[Caroline Desrochers, Liberal, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Yes, the budget is the economic plan.

We're discussing Bill C-15 today, which is our economic plan to deal with the current situation that is happening in our country with the unjustified tariffs we are going through, the trade war that's happening, the cost of living and the housing crisis. We are putting forward credible measures to deal with that. Yet, you stand up and vote no against Canadians every time.

Ms. Joomun, thank you very much again for being here. Can you explain to me to what extent the proposed amendment...?

There are students attending schools outside Canada. How many students are we talking about, who are attending for-profit schools outside Canada, who have a student loan that could be impacted by this? Do you have numbers on that?

[Bibi Wasiimah Joomun]

Again, I want to highlight my mandate. I represent public institutions here. As we are also having discussions about the implementing of this act, there is also a current risk that is going to happen. If, after July 2026, we see no further commitment to continue expansion of the Canada student grants and loans, because we did not see it in budget 2025, we will see a decrease in the number of students who will be accessing those programs and a cut to their support to continue post-secondary education.

Again, it is not my area of expertise to speak on private institutions. We do have the experts here. I am here to talk a bit about the risk that the value of the Canada student financial aid program is about to experience after July 2026.

[Caroline Desrochers, Liberal, Trois-Rivières, QC]

In the budget included in Bill C-15, there is the proposal to increase the Canada summer job wage subsidy, the proposal to increase work on work-integrated learning, and proposals to increase all of these to help with youth unemployment and to help students gain that meaningful first experience. Would you say that those are helpful for students looking to transition into the market?

[Bibi Wasiimah Joomun]

Of course, we're thankful to see that there are so many opportunities that have increased, and I guess, with time, we will see the benefit of these. Again, if we are then creating barriers for students to even get into post-secondary....

As I mentioned in my opening remarks, we did see an increase in groups that are traditionally under-represented going into post-secondary and accessing post-secondary education. We might have job opportunities during their post-secondary education, but if they are not able to even get their foot through the door and attend post-secondary, we will then continue experiencing student unemployment where we will see that high school graduates will not be able to continue post-secondary education, and we will see an increase in unemployment outside of the post-secondary sector as well.

[Caroline Desrochers, Liberal, Trois-Rivières, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Joomun.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Madame Desrochers.

Ms. Larouche, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We're here today to debate the budget implementation bill, Bill C‑15.

In the first part of the meeting, we did talk about the national school food program. Let's be clear. Witnesses came to talk to us about that.

We're asking the Liberals, in good faith, to send us their motion, which we will study, because that is how things work at committee.

I'll try to be brief, Mr. Chair. Then I will turn to the witnesses to ask them questions.

At the last meeting of the Standing Committee on Human Resources, Skills and Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities, I was criticized for not sending my motion 48 hours in advance, which wasn't true. The Liberals criticized me for it, even though evidence showed that it had been sent in advance.

Today, someone walked in and put a motion on the table. I simply suggest that my colleagues do the right thing, which is to send it by email. Then, we will study it in good faith and take a position on the motion when it comes back for debate. It's not that we're opposed to what's in the motion; we simply have to do our work as parliamentarians properly, with the rigour it deserves, and not by spreading disinformation or attempting to attack.

There you go. Now I'll get back to the subject at hand.

You said that Bill C‑15 was an opportunity to talk about the cost of living and housing affordability. That's good timing, since we're hearing testimony on that today.

I'll turn to you, Ms. Joomun.

You said that if this measure is implemented you will be forced to end your studies. Did I understand correctly? So if students are considering leaving their studies, there will be financial consequences.

You also talked about rent, among other things.

What are the consequences of the measure you've come here to tell us about today? You said you will have to end your education and return to the labour market, and that you'll have trouble paying the rent.

On the issue of affordability, we know that the term “affordable housing” can be used in a number of different ways. Is that a good definition? Is the housing being proposed really affordable?

I'd like to hear a little more about what you have to say about this.

[Bibi Wasiimah Joomun]

Thank you very much for the question. I'll answer in English, if that's okay.

We are currently tabling this at our 26 member campuses across Canada. What we hear from students is that they are being told by employers that they need to get a post-secondary education and earn a credential to get into the workforce.

However, what they are currently experiencing is the high cost of living. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, over the past year, we've seen living expenses for our students increase by 71.7%. There has not been any decision made about whether the Canada student grant will continue being expanded after July 2026. That is leaving a lot of students in precarity. The testimony I shared is from a student in a second-year program, so they've already invested two years in the program. They will wake up in the summer of 2026 to find $1,200 less than what they were expecting to get. As I mentioned, students are already facing a lot of barriers. To answer your question, students are very much living in precarity.

In terms of longevity and long-term prospects, it is important to recognize that we are experiencing a decrease in enrolment in general with the international student policy change. Now is the time to encourage our domestic students to pursue post-secondary education because they are the future. They will be the ones building the country that we are saying we will build. I think there is a barrier here that is not allowing people to go into post-secondary.

In terms of affordable housing, I know there are a lot of investments and projects happening, but, again, you need the people to build those houses. That's why we push for apprenticeship. We need the students to go to colleges and get those certificates so they are able to build that housing. The main issue here, and what we are putting at risk, is that we will see fewer and fewer students entering our post-secondary system if there is a decrease in funding.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

When we talk about projects, such as the ones at Build Canada Homes right now, some groups are concerned about what affordability means in terms of the percentage of people's real income that needs to go to housing. That can have an impact, because the more money people put into housing, the less money they have left for food.

You also talk about under-represented groups and students with disabilities. What else can be done to help these under-represented groups and students with disabilities? How could the government support them more?

[Bibi Wasiimah Joomun]

Thank you very much for the question.

We talk to students with disabilities. The costs they end up having are a lot more than they are for someone who is not living with disabilities when it comes to the maintenance of medication or the maintenance of whatever the disability is.

I think we are categorizing them within the same student financial aid program, so that fund becomes a lot more important to them. The $1,200 grant they receive annually is, in fact, important to them. I would say that the cost of living is definitely way higher for them than it is for a student who might be living without a disability.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Ms. Larouche.

I want to clarify this for the committee, because we were scheduled to go in camera at this time: We have time to continue with a second full round of five minutes, five minutes and two and a half minutes.

With that, Mr. Ho, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Vincent Ho, Conservative, Richmond Hill South, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Kirk, could you describe how traditional Chinese medicine and acupuncture students typically finance their education, and where grants fit into that picture?

[Dylan Kirk]

What we see in our sector is that a lot of students are coming in after a liberal arts degree, or as a second career after trying something else. This means many of them may have families or other responsibilities. What I experience in speaking with them is that they are struggling. It's difficult to live in today's economic world, dealing with all the other challenges of life and also being a full-time student in an intensive medical program.

The grant portion is very important. One of the ways we see it, very tangibly, is that the graduate should not be burdened with huge sums of debt that take them many years to get out of.

[Vincent Ho, Conservative, Richmond Hill South, ON]

While we're on that point, what percentage, approximately, of students do you see relying on those federal grants?

[Dylan Kirk]

Somewhere around 80% of students in our college are getting financial aid, and the majority of them have some grant allocation.

[Vincent Ho, Conservative, Richmond Hill South, ON]

What impact do you anticipate on enrolment and the viability of all the programs that are part of your group if the Liberal government recklessly defunds these grants? Would you see enrolment go down?

[Dylan Kirk]

Absolutely. Enrolment would go down. For access to education, people do rely on those grants.