Human Resources Committee on May 28th, 2026

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

The majority of training, including for Red Seal workers, is jurisdictionally the responsibility of the provinces and territories, and we are there as a supportive partner.

First of all, we transfer $3 billion a year to provinces and territories to help with training. The training occurs in a number of different ways. Some of the institutions, you might be familiar with. Youth Employment Services, for example, would be supported in part by federal funds. Of course, provinces and territories have contributions of their own to skills training in a variety of different ways. We also support them through additional top-ups, as I mentioned. I won't reinform you about that. I think you heard my answer around EI measures.

Then, finally, we partner with provinces and territories in a number of important ways on our youth employment strategy. We augment transfers through funding youth employment opportunities across the country. Student work placements are often coordinated through provincial and territorial organizations. We work very closely with them to make sure we're not duplicating and stepping on each other's toes.

What we're trying to offer is really an approach where people have.... I like to say that every door is the right door, and no matter where someone goes in, they're going to find supports. Obviously, there are still gaps. That's why we have the spring economic update, with the $6-billion investment in Red Seal trades.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thanks very much.

We're going to conclude, to be fair, with Madame Larouche for two minutes.

[Andréanne Larouche, Bloc, Shefford, QC]

Minister, requests for food assistance, housing support and social services are skyrocketing across Quebec. That's what I heard on the ground during the past two constituency weeks.

Does the government consider that the current budget meets the scale of the needs? What programs could be enhanced?

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

We're working with Quebec, with all due respect, because the province is very good at carrying out programs. We have meetings with the provinces to provide funding so that they can improve their own programs. I often think of the programs that work very well in Quebec. We learn from them: We draw inspiration from how its programs are designed and apply that to other federal programs.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Ms. Larouche.

Thank you as well, Minister and officials.

We will now move to the votes on the main estimates.

CANADIAN ACCESSIBILITY STANDARDS DEVELOPMENT ORGANIZATION

Vote 1—Operating expenditures..........$11,786,820

Vote 5—Grants and contributions..........$8,500,000

(Votes 1 and 5 agreed to on division)

CANADIAN CENTRE FOR OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY

Vote 1—Program expenditures..........$5,947,344

(Vote 1 agreed to on division)

DEPARTMENT OF EMPLOYMENT AND SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT

Vote 1—Operating expenditures..........$1,111,834,762

Vote 5—Grants and contributions..........$12,513,074,018

(Votes 1 and 5 agreed to on division)

Shall I report these votes on the main estimates to the House, less the amount voted in interim supply?

[An hon. member]

On division.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

I will report them to the House on division.

Thank you, colleagues.

We'll now suspend for a short time to prepare for the next panel, which is on homelessness.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Committee members, please take your seats as we begin the second hour of today's meeting.

I would like to take a few moments to remind those appearing who were not here before that you have the option of participating in today's meeting in the official language of your choice. To do that, please make sure you're on the right channel. If you're in the room, have your earpiece on so that you are hearing the presentations. If you're appearing virtually, please click on the globe icon at the bottom of your screen and choose the official language of your choice. If there is an interruption in interpretation, please get my attention and we will suspend.

Having said that, one witness who was to appear virtually, Ms. Savage, did not pass the sound quality test for interpretation, so she will be rescheduled for a later time.

Please direct all comments through the chair. Wait until I recognize you by name before proceeding.

We are now moving into our study on homelessness in Canada. I would like to welcome our witnesses appearing in person.

From the Calgary Drop-In and Rehab Centre Society, we have Sandra Clarkson, president and chief executive officer, and from Table itinérance Rive-Sud, we have Gilles Beauregard, coordinator.

You each have up to five minutes for opening statements.

We'll begin with you, Ms. Clarkson, please.

[Sandra Clarkson, President and Chief Executive Officer, Calgary Drop-In and Rehab Centre Society]

Thank you, Chair and members of the committee, for the invitation to appear here today.

As mentioned, my name is Sandra Clarkson. I'm the CEO of the Calgary Drop-In Centre, which is one of the largest homeless shelters in the country. It's able to shelter over 1,000 individuals each night. I'm also a co-chair of the Canadian Shelter Transformation Network, which is a growing national collaboration of shelter leaders, frontline organizations, researchers and system partners working together to modernize homeless response systems.

This shift is critical to the homelessness response in Canada. As we're witnessing from coast to coast, homelessness has become more complex. Shelters are increasingly responding to severe addiction, mental illness, chronic health needs, aging, cognitive impairment and long-term homelessness, while communities also face deep housing affordability pressures and too little supportive housing.

Shelters are being asked to serve as emergency response, health stabilization, mental health support and housing providers of last resort. This is not sustainable or humane. We need a homelessness response that remains housing-focused, is better integrated with health and recovery systems and is designed for the level of complexity that communities are now facing.

Housing must remain the central goal. Homelessness is fundamentally a housing issue. Emergency shelters matter, but they cannot become long-term destinations or carry the full burden of the housing crisis.

We need greater investment in support of housing, including deeply affordable housing, transitional housing, medical respite, and housing models with integrated supports matched to differing levels of acuity. Buildings alone do not create housing stability. Supportive housing succeeds when there is sustainable funding. Federal investments are strongest when capital development and long-term operational supports are aligned.

Homelessness and addiction cannot be discussed separately. The toxic drug supply has sharply increased the medical and behavioural complexity seen in shelters and on our streets. One of the clearest themes emerging is the profound impact of addiction and the toxic drug supply. This is not simply about public disorder. It is about human vulnerability, trauma, health and survival. Communities need treatment, detox, mental health supports, harm reduction and long-term recovery pathways that are integrated with housing responses.

Reaching Home should support system transformation. Reaching Home has strengthened coordination and housing-focused practice, but its next phase should also help communities modernize outdated systems. A dedicated homelessness system transformation fund could support integrated health care partnerships, stabilization and recovery environments, prevention and diversion, coordinated access modernization and stronger pathways into housing so that communities can move beyond managing demand and toward better outcomes. This dedicated transformation fund would allow communities to innovate while remaining grounded in measurable outcomes.

Policy must reflect high-acuity need, sustainable operations and prevention. Federal policy should recognize high-acuity homelessness as a distinct challenge requiring integrated housing, health care, mental health and recovery supports. It should also align capital investment with sustainable operating funding, support workforce stability and place greater emphasis on prevention and diversion, including discharge planning, eviction prevention and indigenous-led approaches. Communities need integrated federal-provincial responses built around shared outcomes, not isolated funding silos.

In closing, homelessness in Canada is more complex and more acute than our current systems were designed to address. The response must stay grounded in housing, but it must also be better integrated with health, addiction and recovery supports. If we want better outcomes, we must invest not only in an emergency response, but in system transformation, sustainable operations, and prevention.

Thank you for the opportunity to appear today. I look forward to your questions.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Ms. Clarkson.

Mr. Beauregard, you have the floor for five minutes.

[Gilles Beauregard, Coordinator, Table Itinérance Rive-Sud]

Good morning, everyone. My name is Gilles Beauregard. I am the coordinator of Table Itinérance Rive‑Sud, as well as a proud dad of three children and granddad of grandchildren. I'm proud of all of that, and that is why I mention it.

I have been working in the addiction and homelessness field in Quebec for 40 years. I'm very proud of that. I would like to thank just about everyone.

In the 2000s, I saw what homelessness was like in downtown Montreal. It wasn't easy. That was when funding first came into existence for homelessness groups. The federal government first set up the homelessness partnering initiative. It was then renamed the homelessness partnering strategy. It's now called Reaching Home.

Over the years, this funding for Quebec has gone from $20 million to $35 million. After the COVID‑19 pandemic, that amount rose to $80 million. I think that Quebec currently receives $90 million a year. This has changed the face of Quebec. In the past, most of the funding went to downtown Montreal. Now, more and more funding is being allocated to Quebec as a whole. That's a good thing and a triumph.

Before I comment on what needs to be improved, I think it's important to mention the successes we have collectively achieved. During this period, we have seen both Liberal and Conservative governments come and go. Everyone has done good things, then, and that should be highlighted.

It has also served as a lever for Quebec. In the early 2000s, it was mainly the federal government that gave money. In fact, almost 100% of the money came from the federal government. Over the years, the provincial government has also given money. Its share is now 40%. Of course, the federal government is still very present, but the Government of Quebec also provides funding. Obviously, I can't speak for the other provinces. I can't speak for Ms. Clarkson or for Alberta. What I can say is that, for Quebec, it was a good thing.

For those who don't know, Canada and Quebec have an agreement regarding homelessness. This agreement isn't always easy to manage. Even so, people get along. Quebec very much favours a holistic approach. Fundamentally, this approach focuses heavily on housing, as well as—and this is what we hope to see—resources such as street outreach and support services. For us, it's important to have various measures in place.

When it comes to the Reaching Home program, which is ongoing, there are things that concern us. We would like its funding to be indexed. Unfortunately, despite all the good work we are doing, despite all the money that has been put into this, homelessness is on the rise. It is important to continue the fight and index this money. Often, we receive an envelope for each year, but the amount is not indexed.

It should also be possible to carry amounts forward. Administratively speaking, amounts committed in one year cannot be carried forward to the following year. That sometimes makes the work difficult, especially since the administrative rules aren't always that clear. This leads groups to spend a lot of time working on accountability and less time working with people experiencing homelessness, even though that's what they want to do.

Quebec had a count of people experiencing homelessness, and the number of people experiencing visible homelessness has gone from 10,000 to 12,000. We expect that number to continue rising.

Homelessness exists in all regions of Quebec, and I think it must also exist in all regions of Alberta. Homelessness is everywhere, and it's very worrisome. Small towns that didn't have a homelessness problem now do. Some members of the committee, such as Ms. Larouche, Mr. Joseph and Ms. Desrochers, are very present on the ground.

You can see it; there is homelessness everywhere. We still have work to do to reverse the trend.

I'll end on that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Mr. Beauregard.

We'll now begin the first round of questions. We'll go to Mr. Aitchison for six minutes.

[Scott Aitchison, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I want to thank both of the witnesses who are here.

I'm going to start with Ms. Clarkson.

Can you talk to us a bit more about the efforts you're making at the drop-in centre—not just to house people in emergency shelter, but to truly house people? I'd like to get into this business of understanding not just why homelessness is growing, but how we need to address the issue long-term. The goal is actually ending homelessness.

I'm wondering if you could speak specifically to efforts you're making at the drop-in centre and what we should be doing differently nationally and provincially.

[Sandra Clarkson]

At the Calgary Drop-In Centre, we made a very conscious choice in 2018 to become a housing-focused emergency shelter. Every program and service we offer is intended to lead to a positive housing outcome. Since that time, we've housed over 4,000 people, 70% of whom are in private market housing without a rental subsidy and have been able to maintain their housing. Our return-to-shelter rate has been less than 5% since that time.

A fundamental shift as we look at homeless services across the country is to ensure that every program and service is aimed at a positive housing outcome that can be maintained for people. We need to recognize that it might not always stick the first time, but it's about getting clear on the individual needs and matching them to appropriate housing with relevant supports for the time they need them. Moreover, we need to recognize that everyone who's experienced an episode of homelessness does not necessarily need supportive housing and that CAA should really be considered a last resort for many.

[Scott Aitchison, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

I have a follow-up question, then. Would you say there are very well-meaning organizations in the homelessness space that don't approach their operation the same way you've described, but just look to house as many people as possible?

[Sandra Clarkson]

Emergency shelters traditionally have been funded with the expected outcomes being more output-based, such as sleep nights, meals served, etc., without any expectation of housing outcomes. Certainly in our experience in the province of Alberta, our funding agreements were actually incentivizing us to be full and not have flow-through shelter, because it was based on a per diem rate. That is the wrong metric to be incentivizing; it should be about positive housing outcomes.

We've worked very closely with the provincial government to incorporate housing-focused outcomes and language into the core service agreements. It's about moving beyond immediate needs—food, clothing and shelter—to actually finding a pathway for people out of homelessness and reintegrating them back into the community.

[Scott Aitchison, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Would you say that oftentimes—certainly in the past—the approach to addressing homelessness issues in communities was all too often about creating a band-aid, like giving some money to make sure there aren't people on the street, and that's where it ended? Are we only now starting to address this in a more comprehensive way?

I think it was said that Quebec favours a more holistic approach. A holistic approach, I would think, is actually ending homelessness. Imagine if our goal were to put you guys out of business, for example.

What would you change federally, whether it's the Reaching Home program or the renewal that's about to start with the government's national housing strategy? What would you change with the way those programs operate to make the work you're doing easier?

[Sandra Clarkson]

The biggest need we see is for more supportive housing and operational support to provide that housing, particularly for really complex individuals. The Calgary Drop-In Centre is a low-barrier shelter, and the complexity of the people we see continues to increase year over year. The challenge is that there is nowhere for them to go, so they continue to languish in shelter. They are often our high system users who are very visible in downtown cores, and we need to address that really complex population to help with some of the visibility issues. More and more, people in the community don't want to see them. They don't really care what happens; they just don't want to see them.

We have an opportunity to really modernize our homeless-serving systems of care to be relentlessly housing-focused, from prevention to getting somebody into recovery treatment and housing. That's what I would recommend: that we look at the continuum and work together with provincial partners to ensure that we're all rowing in the same direction and not operating in silos.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

You have five seconds left.

[Scott Aitchison, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

Thank you. I hope we'll have an opportunity to talk some more.

[The Chair, Liberal, Bobby Morrissey]

Thank you, Mr. Aitchison.

Mr. Joseph, you have the floor for six minutes.

[Natilien Joseph, Liberal, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'd like to thank Mr. Beauregard and Ms. Clarkson for being here.

Mr. Beauregard, we're going to discuss prevention. Many experts say that prevention remains the most effective tool for reversing the trend. Based on your experience, do you agree with that observation?

[Gilles Beauregard]

Prevention is definitely important. For example, young people leaving youth centres find themselves without support and end up on the streets. That isn't what we want. Homelessness isn't their life journey. That means it's important to intervene quickly with that type of client. We don't want these young people to experience homelessness. Like all members of this committee, we want to end homelessness. This is an important way to prioritize these young people.

These days, a new phenomenon is emerging in the major shelters, which Ms. Clarkson is no doubt seeing in Calgary. People who work, who have jobs, are ending up in the centres. It makes no sense. It's important to work with that type of client. In terms of serious cases, it's more complex when the time comes to intervene. However, these cases are less complex: Since these people have fewer experiences with homelessness, the mountain to climb is lower. It's important to reach young people aged 18 to 25 and workers.

However, when it comes to intervening in complex cases, relationships have to be built. When someone in their family—be it a brother, sister or uncle—has a substance abuse and addiction problem, it takes time to develop a trusting relationship with them; there's no magic wand. The profile of people experiencing homelessness differs across Canada: there are young people, seniors and people who are working. Their journeys are completely different, and that's why each case has to be addressed on its own merits. There's also the case of indigenous people. If people from Manitoba were here beside me, they could tell us about the indigenous people who live in Winnipeg. These are complex situations.

When it comes to Quebec, what it does well is that it makes a collective effort within the ecosystems. There are a number of ecosystems in Quebec, some 15 of them. Whether it's in Trois-Rivières, Longueuil, Montreal or Laval, each ecosystem approaches the problem a bit differently. It makes a difference when communities work together, when communities, cities, police, community groups and the municipal level work together. Working in partnership makes a huge difference. There isn't just one solution; there are several.

[Natilien Joseph, Liberal, Longueuil—Saint-Hubert, QC]

There are experts who say that prevention costs less than getting someone off the streets. Can you tell us a bit more about that?

[Gilles Beauregard]

The Union des municipalités du Québec did a study on the cost associated with that. I think it determined this to be around $70,000 per homeless person. Of course, there's always a cost associated with reintegration. There may be a way to look at homelessness from an economic perspective. However, the fact remains that these people are human beings; they are our brothers and sisters. It's important to mention that we're all responsible. We have a collective responsibility in this regard.