We are long over our time.
Evidence of meeting #19 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was alberta.
Evidence of meeting #19 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 39th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was alberta.
2:45 p.m.
Bloc
Thierry St-Cyr Bloc Jeanne-Le Ber, QC
So your only compensation comes from the employer, and no money comes from people who are recruited.
2:45 p.m.
NDP
Olivia Chow NDP Trinity—Spadina, ON
You suggested monitoring the subcontractors. That would then give the contract to another subcontractor. The other subcontractor would then hire temporary foreign workers and end up paying them half the wages of the industrial standard.
How did your company monitor it, for example?
2:50 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
We haven't seen that. The companies we work with typically are under CLAC, which is the Christian Labour Association of Canada, and the union. They are all governed under a collective agreement. The wages are fixed, so there is no possibility of paying outside that wage scale.
2:50 p.m.
NDP
Olivia Chow NDP Trinity—Spadina, ON
But you have other companies that operate in Toronto and British Columbia.
2:50 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
We don't. Our firm doesn't. We are an Alberta-based company.
As I say, we've heard of these companies, and they are sneaking into the construction industry. Typically they've been known in the unskilled sector. Meat packing is probably one area, and it's been in the news--workers were brought over from other countries and paid very large sums of money to work--but in the construction sector there isn't a lot of opportunity for a company to skew outside of those wages.
Although I'm saying that, some companies we call ask if they can't just pay this worker the minimum wage. It's up to us if we want to work with a company like that, and our response is no. But they are out there.
We, as a company--and we're just one company--can keep our eyes on that and make the government aware, but I don't know the answer. That's a good question--how to eliminate companies from paying below the wage that they should be.
2:50 p.m.
NDP
Olivia Chow NDP Trinity—Spadina, ON
You obviously support advocacy centres. Earlier on there was a suggestion of asking the employer to pay a certain amount, and that dollar amount would then go to a fund. The fund then would go to support the advocacy centre.
Is that something that you or your colleagues in the industry would support?
2:50 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
I think it would be an option for sure, if it came up, if it eliminated unscrupulous recruiters and unscrupulous acts.
We don't have an association in Alberta that governs the recruitment industry. We have the Government of Alberta that governs the recruitment industry. Because it is, as I said, illegal—you go to jail if you charge placement fees, but you don't go to jail if you mistreat workers. That's where the Alberta labour standards come in. We know it has worked because there was a company whose LMO was removed because they were abusing the system.
That would be an option. We'd certainly be open to any suggestions.
2:50 p.m.
NDP
Olivia Chow NDP Trinity—Spadina, ON
What do you think of changes that would fit all the criteria? Let's say you apply for a group of workers to come, and then even after you fit all the criteria, the workers are not given the visas for whatever reason. Is that something you're worried about?
2:50 p.m.
NDP
Olivia Chow NDP Trinity—Spadina, ON
Yes. After the criteria are all met, for whatever reason they still would not get their visa.
2:50 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
We have run into that. The timing of that question is good. We were just in one of the embassies with a large construction company asking about that, because certainly if a worker doesn't get a visa and they've been through the process with the immigration officer and that immigration officer deems they are not fit for Canada, then that's the right answer.
2:50 p.m.
NDP
Olivia Chow NDP Trinity—Spadina, ON
Right now you could appeal, right? If you have the funds, you can hire a lawyer and then you can appeal it. But if the change is that you no longer have the legal right to appeal it, would that cause you some concern?
2:50 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
It would because we've been through this process and we've appealed it ourselves.
We're not immigration lawyers, nor do we have a lawyer on staff. That is by choice. We deal with a law firm in Edmonton that deals with matters, and the companies we work with have their own lawyers. We had a situation—can I give an example or make a comment?
2:50 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
We've had very good success in terms of visas for candidates to come over. As I said earlier, they go through a process with the Alberta government where they are accredited. It's called AIT, and they check every application with every employer that the candidate worked for to ensure they have the proper qualifications to work in Canada. Part of getting their journeyman, their Red Seal status, is they have to go through this.
2:55 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Norman Doyle
We're out of time here. I only have about 10 minutes left.
Ms. Grewal.
Maybe you can get your comments in again, Ms. Chow.
2:55 p.m.
Conservative
Nina Grewal Conservative Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Yesterday, as well as today, we have heard from various witnesses about their views on the exploitation of these workers. How do we protect these vulnerable individuals from being exploited? Are there any laws in place? This is my main concern.
2:55 p.m.
President, TC Hunter
Yes, actually there are. The RCMP is heavily involved in this. We had a conversation with individuals heading up that program.
It's called human trafficking, and they're now being treated as victims. If an individual is brought here under false pretenses and has paid a fee—or even if they didn't pay a fee but were brought here and lied to here and they arrived in Alberta—they will be treated as victims. It is Canada. It's a Canadian-funded program. The company and the individuals who were responsible for bringing these workers over under false pretenses will be prosecuted, absolutely. But they can't do anything unless somebody brings it to their attention.