Evidence of meeting #14 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was irb.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Sheila Fraser  Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada
Simon Coakeley  Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

9:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Maurizio Bevilacqua

I call this meeting to order, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), for a study of chapter 2 of the report of the Auditor General of Canada, March 2009, “Governor in Council Appointments Process”.

As witnesses today, we are pleased to have with us the Auditor General of Canada, Sheila Fraser, and from the Office of the Auditor General of Canada, we have Anne Marie Smith, principal, and Jean Goulet, director. From the Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada, we have Simon Coakeley, executive director. Welcome.

Madam Fraser, you've done enough of these to know how the process works. You make opening comments and thereafter we have questions and answers. Thank you. You may begin.

9:05 a.m.

Sheila Fraser Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

Thank you, Chair. We are very pleased to be here today to discuss our chapter on the Governor in Council appointments process.

As you mentioned, I am joined at the table by Anne Marie Smith, principal, and Jean Goulet, director, who are responsible for this audit. Our audit examined the process used to make Governor in Council, or GIC, appointments to crown corporations, small federal entities, and, of most interest to this committee, the Immigration and Refugee Board.

The Immigration and Refugee Board, or the IRB, is a case study of the seriousness of issues that can develop as a result of insufficient attention paid to appointments. High vacancy rates and high turnover of board members have significantly contributed to increased delays in rendering decisions and a large backlog of unprocessed cases. The result is uncertainty for claimants and significant cost to social programs.

Overall, the audit found there was unsatisfactory progress since our previous audits. Issues related to the IRB were first raised as long ago as 1997. At that time, we had serious concerns about the high turnover among board members and delays in making appointments, which resulted in a high number of vacant positions. While we noted some improvement in our 2001 follow-up report, turnover and vacancy rates observed in this audit were higher than those in 1997. As of September 20, 2008, there were about 10,000 unresolved appeals and more than 50,000 unprocessed refugee claims.

Our audit found there was a well-defined process in place for recommending members for appointment to the IRB, which has significantly evolved since 2004. The process now involves an initial screening of candidates, suitability screening by a panel of senior-level IRB officials and external experts called the selection advisory board, a written test with a predetermined passing mark, and an interview by the selection advisory board. Following reference checks, recommended candidates are added to a list presented by the IRB chairperson to the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration for consideration in recommending appointments to the Governor in Council. The IRB chairperson also makes recommendations to the minister on reappointments of members whose terms are coming to an end, based on an assessment of their performance.

Following the changes made to improve the appointment process over the last four years, we expected that appointments would be made in a timely manner and that the Immigration and Refugee Board would be staffed with the number of decision-makers it required to achieve its mandate. However, at March 31, 2008, only 106 positions of a total approved complement of 164 positions were occupied—a vacancy rate of 35%. As of September 20, 2008, the IRB had a 23% vacancy rate.

Our audit also found that incumbent members were not treated respectfully when their appointments were due for renewal. Decisions on reappointment were not made or communicated in a timely manner—with members often notified only a short time prior to their terms' expiry and many after their terms expired. In addition, the Immigration and Refugee Board, which must arrange office space, case workloads and training for new members, is not always informed of the start date of new members. We are concerned that the case inventory will likely have grown since we completed our audit. The committee may wish to ask the board for information on the current status of the backlog.

As a final note, the government's response to our recommendations in the chapter gives little indication of the actions it intends to take to address the concerns that we raised. Your committee may wish to explore this further, including whether the government has developed any action plans, timelines or other strategies to deal with the inventory of unresolved cases on a timely basis, taking into account the current and projected number of new cases.

Mr. Chair, this concludes my opening remarks. We would be pleased to answer any questions that committee members may have.

9:05 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Maurizio Bevilacqua

Thank you very much.

We will now proceed to our question and answer section. We'll begin with Ms. Mendes....

Oh, sorry; we will not begin with our questions. We will continue with our witnesses.

Go ahead.

9:05 a.m.

Simon Coakeley Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Good morning and thank you for the invitation to appear before you today. I am pleased to have this opportunity to introduce myself to the committee and provide you with information on the Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada's governor in council selection process.

My name is Simon Coakeley. In September 2008, I was appointed to the position of executive director at the Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada. As executive director of the IRB, I am its chief operating officer and responsible for the performance of the board's adjudicative support and corporate services.

I'd like to start by giving you a little bit more background on the way in which the GIC selection process is managed within the IRB.

As Ms. Fraser has indicated, the basis of our selection process is the selection advisory board, or SAB. This board was created in July of 2007. The board consists of nine members: the chair of the IRB; four persons--jointly appointed by the Minister of Citizenship, Immigration and Multiculturalism and the chair--from outside the IRB; and four other persons--appointed by the IRB chair--from within. At the moment, three of the four persons appointed by the chair are senior GIC people within the IRB, and one is a senior public servant.

All members of the SAB are required to affirm their impartiality in all aspects of the selection process. Under this process, the chair is accountable for the identification of qualified candidates. The chair then recommends these candidates to the minister for consideration for appointment.

The selection process is transparent and merit-based, ensuring that only qualified candidates are considered for appointment. The IRB has established the behavioural competencies for governor in council members to ensure that they have the necessary skills, abilities and personal suitability to fulfill their tasks. These competencies are the basis for the evaluation of candidates for appointment to the IRB, as well as for the ongoing evaluation of member performance.

These competencies are: oral and written communication, conceptual thinking, decision-making, information seeking, judgment and analytical thinking, organizational skills, results orientation, self-control and cultural competence. All these competencies can be found on the IRB's website.

All applicants undergo a preliminary screening that evaluates basic requirements, such as education and experience, against the criteria published on our website. The SAB then meets with and reviews the applications of all candidates screened in. Based on the objective criteria established, a consensus is reached on the suitability of candidates for further consideration. Candidates are advised in writing of their status at that point.

The written test that Ms. Fraser spoke about is then administered to candidates screened in by the SAB. The test evaluates four competencies: conceptual thinking, judgment and analytical thinking, decision-making and written communication.

As Ms. Fraser mentioned, the written test is marked on a pass/fail basis and candidates must demonstrate that they meet each competency. If candidates do not meet all competencies, they fail the test. Once again, candidates are advised in writing whether or not they have been successful.

Successful candidates are invited to a behavioural event interview by a panel consisting of the IRB chairperson or a designate, normally a SAB member, of one of the external SAB members appointed jointly by the chair of the Board and the minister, and of one IRB senior manager, such as myself. In addition, there is one external human resources consultant who is an active member of the interview panel.

The interview panel conducts a behavioural event interview and will assess candidates based on six competencies: oral communication, information seeking, self-control, organizational skills, results orientation and cultural competence. Once again, candidates must demonstrate that they have passed all competencies. The decision is based on a consensus of the panel, not a vote. All members of the interview panel have received appropriate training in conducting behavioural event interviews.

As I mentioned, since my arrival at the IRB, I and a number of my public service colleagues have received formal training on the behavioural event interview technique, which is used to assess the candidates against their competencies. And I have participated, as have a number of my other senior public servant colleagues, in the interview process.

Based on the results of the interview and based on the results of the validation checks of the behavioural competencies, the IRB chair communicates, in writing, the names of the qualified candidates to the minister. The minister then recommends appointments to the Governor in Council from among the pool of qualified candidates. In doing so, he takes into consideration such factors as IRB operational requirements, the three locations of our operations, gender, diversity, and linguistic requirements.

When a member's appointment is due to expire, the chair provides the minister with a recommendation on whether or not the member should be reappointed. The chair bases his recommendation on the member's performance. The minister then makes a recommendation on the reappointment to the Governor in Council, after taking note of the IRB chair's recommendations.

As Ms. Fraser commented in her recent report, she recognizes that the IRB consistently follows established procedures to solicit and assess new candidates for appointment to the IRB. During the period covered by Ms. Fraser's review, new candidates were regularly recommended to the minister, and recommendations for reappointments were consistently made six months in advance of the expiry date of the incumbents' terms.

Among her recommendations, the report called on the government and the IRB to work together to determine an appropriate complement of members or other strategy to deal with the response of unprocessed refugee claims and unresolved immigration appeals on a timely basis.

While all three of the IRB's divisions have faced increases in their workload over the last few years, the RPD faces the most significant challenges. As of March 2009, the backlog in the RPD stood at 58,000 cases. Average processing time in the RPD currently stands at 17.7 months; in the IAD, it is 11.4 months. We recognize that these times are too long. The shortfall in the complement of members has been a significant concern to the IRB well before the release of the Auditor General's status report. As of today, the number of vacancies stands at 26 members. The IRB welcomes the recommendation of the Auditor General that, in the future, the IRB be staffed in a timely manner with the required number of decision-makers who have the knowledge, skills and experience to carry out the board's mandate.

The IRB is pleased that the Auditor General has recognized the processes for soliciting, assessing, and recommending qualified candidates to the minister as being sound and that the report acknowledges that the IRB selection process for recommending reappointments to the minister was done in a timely manner. We continue to work cooperatively with the minister and the government to determine the appropriate complement of IRB members to meet workload.

In closing, I would simply note that new members are being appointed to the IRB. In fact, as recently as last week, four new members were appointed to the board, one in Vancouver and three in Toronto.

Thank you very much. I would be pleased to answer any questions you may have.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Maurizio Bevilacqua

Thank you very much, Mr. Coakeley.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

Do you have any more reports?

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Maurizio Bevilacqua

No, they are all from the Auditor General's office. It's up to you now.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

It's up to me. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much for your presentations.

I'm wondering what the reasons would be for an incumbent's appointment not to be renewed, if that person has done three or four mandates and suddenly his or her appointment is not renewed.

Mr. Coakeley, please.

9:15 a.m.

Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

Simon Coakeley

The chair makes his recommendation based on the performance and the extent to which the board member continues to demonstrate the competencies I outlined, and also the extent to which a board member is performing adequately in terms of hearing the required number of cases and delivering written decisions on time. The chair makes that recommendation to the minister, and then it's up to the minister to decide whether or not to make the reappointment.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

Is the incumbent ever aware of the results of that evaluation?

9:15 a.m.

Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

Simon Coakeley

The board member is made aware of the chair's recommendation--

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

And the evaluation that supports it too?

9:15 a.m.

Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

Okay.

If someone has been there for two or three mandates and is suddenly taken out, considering the cost that it represents to the government to train a new person, as these are jobs that need a great deal of training, why would someone suddenly stop being capable? That is something that surprises me, as I've seen be the case two or three times.

9:15 a.m.

Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

Simon Coakeley

I can't speak to specific cases--

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

I'm not speaking about specific cases.

9:15 a.m.

Executive Director, Immigration and Refugee Board of Canada

Simon Coakeley

The general pattern of appointments is that a member is appointed initially for a three-year period. If the member is reappointed, it is usually for a five-year period, and then, at that point, successive appointments are usually for a one-year period. I believe we've had one member in the recent past whose total length of time was extended to 11 years, but generally speaking, even from the members' point of view, most members, by the end of about eight, nine or ten years, are actually looking at moving on to other stages in their career.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

Alexandra Mendes Liberal Brossard—La Prairie, QC

Thank you very much.

That's it for now.

9:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Maurizio Bevilacqua

Monsieur St-Cyr.

9:15 a.m.

Bloc

Thierry St-Cyr Bloc Jeanne-Le Ber, QC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Ms. Fraser, I have read your report carefully. Because of the nature of your work, you focus on the way in which the process operates. You do not examine the appointments as such, and their qualities. That is a great pity, I find, because I would have a number of things to say to you about that. As I know that you will not be able to comment, I will not bring it up.

According to the process, the board makes a recommendation and the minister then appoints the person. Does the minister have any choice in this process, or is it automatic, a rubber stamp? Does the minister have any flexibility when selecting the candidates recommended by the board? Mr. Coakeley can answer as well.

9:20 a.m.

Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

Sheila Fraser

The decision whether or not to appoint a candidate is always the prerogative of the minister and the governor in council. At the end of our audit, that list contained almost 100 names of people recommended, or deemed suitable, for a position. As we said, some people can be reappointed or recommended for extension. The report mentions that only 42% of the people recommended for reappointment have actually been reappointed.

9:20 a.m.

Bloc

Thierry St-Cyr Bloc Jeanne-Le Ber, QC

Even if the minister decided to fill all the vacant positions, there would be more names on the list than positions to be filled. So there really are choices to be made.

9:20 a.m.

Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

9:20 a.m.

Bloc

Thierry St-Cyr Bloc Jeanne-Le Ber, QC

If, after the fact, the minister sees that an appointment is not working, either because there was an error in selection or because, once in place, a member is clearly not doing his job, do the board and the minister have the powers needed to terminate the appointment?

9:20 a.m.

Auditor General of Canada, Office of the Auditor General of Canada

Sheila Fraser

It would be more appropriate for Mr. Coakeley to answer that question, Mr. Chair.