Okay. I'm good.
Evidence of meeting #74 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was state.
A video is available from Parliament.
Evidence of meeting #74 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was state.
A video is available from Parliament.
9:30 a.m.
Conservative
Rick Dykstra Conservative St. Catharines, ON
Thanks, Chair.
Taking the point of Mr. Opitz, maybe Salma and Asif could comment on the whole idea of the radicalization of youth and what happens as a result. You spoke to it somewhat, Asif, in your opening comments, about the trend where young people are trained and radicalized in order to stand up for, defend, or promote terrorism and who somehow consider that to be an honour.
We had the RCMP and CSIS here at our last meeting and it was a little bit more difficult for them to give us pertinent details about certain cases. Mr. Lamoureux stated that there were four cases to his understanding. We actually heard from them that there have been 15 such cases over the last number of years. Obviously the youth are convinced or conscripted into this, and I wondered about your thoughts on that and how it impacts the bill.
9:35 a.m.
National Secretary for Public Relations, Ahmadiyya Muslim Jama'at
Are you asking if I think radicalization is on the rise? Is that the question?
9:35 a.m.
National Secretary for Public Relations, Ahmadiyya Muslim Jama'at
I'm not privy to those CSIS reports, but if they're saying that it's happening and they have findings that it is happening, I would suggest that it's probably a lot more than what they found because where there's one that you can even find, there are many that you cannot find. It is prevalent. I wouldn't say that it's radically increasing, but it is prevalent and it is a concern of the Canadian government to make sure that it's rooted out.
9:35 a.m.
Liberal
Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB
I have a point of order, Mr. Chairperson.
I believe what Mr. Dykstra is referring to is the amendments that the minister is talking about and terrorists in general, whereas my questioning was strictly in regard to the bill and threats against the Canadian Forces when I talked about there being fewer than five such cases. I say this just so that we're clear on that.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative David Tilson
Listening to the minister's comments, I think we're pretty well letting anything go. We haven't seen the amendment yet, but just from listening to his comments, I have a feeling that they're going to be fairly broad. So we're letting pretty well anything go.
Mr. Dykstra, you're back on.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
9:35 a.m.
President, Muslim Canadian Congress
Are you asking if radicalization is on the increase?
9:35 a.m.
President, Muslim Canadian Congress
Again, I definitely think it is, and it's becoming fashionable to see.... It's peer pressure. It definitely is, and I think if some people are given a clear indicator that it's not acceptable, hopefully we will see some changes.
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
Rick Dykstra Conservative St. Catharines, ON
One discussion that comes up on a regular basis is the whole issue that a dual citizen is the only one who would face the risk of losing Canadian citizenship. It would seem to me that you could actually take this from a different perspective, which is that the only person who actually can risk losing citizenship is one who wants to use Canadian citizenship as a vehicle to transfer oneself to another country to train or to commit a terrorist act. I want to get your thoughts on that specifically. Would it not seem more likely that dual citizens would potentially use their Canadian citizenship to protect themselves and therefore train, and that this would potentially lead to a terrorist act, versus someone who only has Canadian citizenship?
9:35 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative David Tilson
You are way over, Mr. Dykstra.
A very brief answer from just one of you, because we are over the time.
9:35 a.m.
National Secretary for Public Relations, Ahmadiyya Muslim Jama'at
I think the answer is yes, but that's not to say that only dual citizens of other countries can be terrorists. There are people who can be terrorists here too, who are born and raised here, so let's not just paint everyone with the same brush.
March 26th, 2013 / 9:35 a.m.
NDP
Sadia Groguhé NDP Saint-Lambert, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I would first like to thank our witnesses for being here today.
If you don’t mind, before I begin my questions, I would like to respond to the letter that we have received from Trisha Mitrocsak.
I would like to remind the members of the committee that our comments can truly have an impact on those who hear them. When a member of Parliament refers to immigrants as bad apples, that has consequences. When another MP can’t stop talking about terrorism and radicalization in relation to immigration, that can also have consequences. Make no mistake about it. I could talk at length about the consequences. I have seen the real impact of those comments in a society that claims to be united. Some of our comments can go beyond the context of our speeches and can make people react. Those people don’t know all the ins and outs of everything we discuss in committee. As a matter of fact, that can really make people have a feeling of rejection and create division in our society.
I simply wanted to alert all the members, including those of our party, and ask them to tone down their comments, to exercise sound judgment at all times when they say something and to avoid stigmatizing people.
I will continue with my questions.
9:40 a.m.
Conservative
Rick Dykstra Conservative St. Catharines, ON
Mr. Chair, on a point of order, I have no idea what Sadia is talking about. I'm not sure how it relates to our committee. I have no idea how it relates to the questions we are asking here. A speech in the House of Commons is fine, but I'm not sure this relates at all to what we are talking about this morning.
9:40 a.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative David Tilson
Let's put it this way. She said it, and we're now going to hear a question.
9:40 a.m.
NDP
Sadia Groguhé NDP Saint-Lambert, QC
That’s fine.
My question is for all of you.
We have all seen the impact of the 2001 attacks on the Muslim community. The impact was really strong and is still being felt today. No matter what passport the people of the Muslim community use to cross the border, they are still being stigmatized and singled out.
In your view, will Bill C-425 have a similar impact on those types of situations and on the prevention of terrorist acts?
9:40 a.m.
President, Muslim Canadian Congress
I'm a little confused, but I'll try to answer as much as I possibly can.
In 2001, 9/11 had an impact on everyone. The fact is, yes, the Muslim community was impacted, but we also stood up and said we were not going to defend what some minority of Muslims had done. This bill would have a very positive impact in the sense that people will know that this loyalty is not tolerated by anyone. It's not just the Muslims. It's not based on religion or ethnicity. It is across the board. The fact is, that makes it much harder for people to buy into it.
We can talk about many things. We can talk about what happened with the security certificates and how it impacted us, because everybody said, these people are coming and they are destroying our country. It's a two-way dialogue and we need much more time than this. I would love to appear and talk about the experiences that elders have had because of this. They see their religion as being taken and hijacked. The impact is not given in one minute. Maybe we can be allowed to come again and talk about the impact. I think this is positive.