Evidence of meeting #21 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was abuse.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Kathryn Marshall  Lawyer, As an Individual
Audrey Macklin  Professor and Chair in Human Rights Law, Faculty of Law, University of Toronto, As an Individual
Elizabeth Long  Barrister and Solicitor, Long Mangalji LLP, As an Individual
Poran Poregbal  Founder, Executive Director and Therapist, Greater Vancouver Counselling and Education Society for Families
Laila Fakhri  Crisis Intervention Counsellor, Herizon House Women's Shelter
Adeena Niazi  Executive Director, Afghan Women's Organization

4:20 p.m.

Barrister and Solicitor, Long Mangalji LLP, As an Individual

Elizabeth Long

I'm sorry, I disagree with that. Love can happen in arranged marriages as well but that's not our decision, to decide whether or not two people can be together because of their language requirements or how much they know.

What if you have a child in the marriage? What would happen if the person does not have minimum income? Often the person who is sponsored is the breadwinner, so you cannot say just because a person does not meet a minimum income that the family will go on social assistance. There are already ways to deter that. The person who is being sponsored can't go on social assistance anyway.

4:20 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

Thank you very much. I will have to stop you here. I'm sorry. Your time is over.

Now we'll turn to Mr. Sandhu for five minutes.

4:20 p.m.

NDP

Jasbir Sandhu NDP Surrey North, BC

Thank you. I have a very direct question for Audrey Macklin. Can you define an arranged marriage and a forced marriage?

4:20 p.m.

Prof. Audrey Macklin

I don't think these are legal terms of art, so I am not going to try to pretend they are, but I think that the South Asian Legal Clinic of Ontario, for example, has done considerable work to raise awareness around these issues, and I commend their work on it to you.

I think the distinction they draw is that forced marriage is not the same as an arranged marriage. In an arranged marriage, both parties give their full and free consent, while in cases of forced marriage, one or both of the spouses do not consent. People of all cultural backgrounds have experienced forced marriages. In Canada forced marriages sometimes happen within newcomer communities, and the clinic goes on to talk about it as a form of family violence. They certainly do draw a distinction between arranged marriage and forced marriage, I think with a view to not letting the spectre of forced marriage become an excuse or a device to reduce or refuse the family reunification of people from cultures where arranged marriages are practised.

4:25 p.m.

NDP

Jasbir Sandhu NDP Surrey North, BC

We've heard concerns during these hearings, not only yesterday but from many witnesses, regarding women being isolated. When a woman is being abused, isolation also plays a role in having that woman report the abuse to proper authorities. Do you think that's a barrier, and could it be broken down, especially with regard to women who are isolated from their own families?

4:25 p.m.

Prof. Audrey Macklin

I think isolation is a feature of domestic violence that is common across all cultural and linguistic backgrounds. Our shelters are full of anglophone and francophone women who can talk about the experience of being isolated by their abusers, so I don't think it's unique to any particular cultural or linguistic group.

4:25 p.m.

NDP

Jasbir Sandhu NDP Surrey North, BC

Would it help if you had your immediate family there to help reduce that isolation?

4:25 p.m.

Lawyer, As an Individual

Kathryn Marshall

Absolutely. Familial support can be crucial as a bridge to seeking assistance and support, and I think that has to be true, generally. There are many different potential sources of support and family is one of them, for sure.

4:25 p.m.

NDP

Jasbir Sandhu NDP Surrey North, BC

Currently, under the Conservative government, we've seen long lineups for family reunification. It takes at least eight or nine years to get your family, to reunite with a spouse. Do you think that's also hindering a person in reporting...not helping the individual who's being abused?

4:25 p.m.

Prof. Audrey Macklin

Delays in family reunification damage almost everybody. They damage the person in Canada who is wanting to be reunited with her family member. They damage the person abroad who is waiting to be reunited, possibly with children. It is damaging economically, because you have an economic unit that is splintered. It is damaging psychologically, because the longer it takes for children to get to Canada, the longer it will take for them to adapt to the Canadian public school system, which—I think as Ms. Marshall rightly pointed out—is a wonderful tool of integration.

Delays in family reunification do damage not just to the individuals. Ultimately they do damage to Canada by depriving Canadians at large of the maximum benefits that immigration can bring. So for all of those reasons, including the ones that you have highlighted, delays are a real problem.

It's noteworthy that, by adding the conditional sponsorship, we have added yet more layers and sources of delay in family reunification. We haven't eliminated overseas screening, we've just added another layer, and that just slows things down more.

4:25 p.m.

NDP

Jasbir Sandhu NDP Surrey North, BC

Thank you.

Are there any other barriers that prevent women from reporting abuse; any recommendations that you can offer to this committee?

4:25 p.m.

Prof. Audrey Macklin

No, I think, if I may say something slightly related to this, because earlier, the prospect of language and the importance of women learning English or French was accentuated, and that's always a good thing. It would be worth this committee studying what the barriers to that might be. Is it child care? Is it economic? What are the reasons women aren't able to access language training, if this is the case? It might be worth inquiring into why, as a prelude to thinking about what kinds of policy responses would be appropriate for that.

4:25 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

Thank you.

Thank you very much once again to all of you for agreeing for a second time to come in front of us as witnesses.

You had to go back home because of scheduling changes that were out of the hands of the members of this committee. We sincerely apologize for the inconveniences this may have caused and we are very pleased that you were able to come back to this committee and that we were able to devote a full hour to listening to what you have to contribute to this study.

Again, thank you very much.

I will now suspend the meeting and invite the next witnesses to be seated at the table.

4:30 p.m.

NDP

Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe NDP Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC

We will now resume the 21st meeting of the Standing Committee on Citizenship and Immigration.

Thank you to our three witnesses for being here with us this afternoon.

We are pleased to welcome you.

For this second half of the meeting, we will have:

From Greater Vancouver Counselling and Education Society for Families, we have Poran Poregbal, founder, executive director, and therapist. Welcome.

From Herizon House Women's Shelter, Laila Fakhri, crisis intervention counsellor, is here. Welcome.

Also from Afghan Women's Organization, we have Adeena Niazi, executive director. Thank you very much.

As I said before, I'm sorry that it's the second time we have had to invite you, but it's a pleasure that you accepted our invitation.

We'll start right away with eight-minute opening remarks.

We'll start with Madame Poregbal, please. You have the floor.

4:35 p.m.

Poran Poregbal Founder, Executive Director and Therapist, Greater Vancouver Counselling and Education Society for Families

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you very much for inviting me here. It's a pleasure to be here.

I am a therapist with a background in social work. Since 1994 I have been working as a social worker, a rehabilitation worker, and a victim support worker, and now since 2009 I have been offering my clinical expertise to my community. Wearing this hat, I have witnessed and I have talked to and worked with a huge number of the women whom you're talking about and you're studying about in this committee.

The thing that we have to understand is that there are many kinds of cultural norms here for talking about the sponsored women and why they are coming, why they are accepting. I have worked with over 100 women who are, one by one, telling me if they had known that the information their husband gave them the first day was wrong and fake and overexaggerated, they would never have come. If they had known the signs and symptoms of abuse, of the mental health issues that their husbands suffered from, they would never have come.

Most often these women who come, and they're going through what they are going through, we have to treat them for the mental health issues and the psychological damages they have experienced through this situation.

First of all, since 2009 my organization has been offering many programs to a wide range of families, mostly Farsi-speaking communities—people from Iran, Afghanistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, and you name it, those countries whose people speak Farsi. You may question why Farsi-speaking. It's because we...myself, I come from Iran. Twenty-seven years ago I left Iran. I and many of my colleagues who left Iran all these years, we know by experience, lived experiences, that people have been traumatized and they are still being traumatized.

You know the human rights situations in Iran. The most of what we are offering is about offering our clinical expertise. What is clinical expertise? It's helping people understand the importance of healthy relationships, of anger management, of interpersonal relationships, of understanding the effects of traumas on their minds, understanding healthy parenting. These are the things that we are offering through our programs.

We started as an agency with seven counsellors. Now we are 22 people, although we are operating mostly based on our clinical-based programs and some small grants. Still, we are able to offer parenting, marital relationships programs, youth support programs, you name it.

In those programs we are dealing with and exploring the issues of migration for women and men equally. As a parent, as an individual, what are the issues that they are dealing with in adjusting and being integrated into this community? There are issues of loss of identity, boundaries, victims' rights, parenting responsibilities, mental health issues. That is huge, and that is very silent; it is stigmatized. We are explaining relationship health and the psychological stressors that we as a community are going through. Migration has never been something that we people from Iran, Afghanistan, and those countries learned or were used to. This is a situation that we are in because of the long-term operation of human rights worsening in our home countries.

The psychological stresses that many people are dealing with and living with, they come here with. We bring, with our luggage, those traumas. Understanding those traumas is very important in order to understand those men who are abusers and those women who are being abused. I have worked with those men too.

I have asked many of those men why they have been doing this. What is going on? I have visited them in jails, hospitals, mental health institutions, and so on. They all tell me, once they trust that they can talk and that they are being understood, after a therapeutic relationship has been built, that if they had known this type of behaviour was wrong, they would have never done it. They are men who have been abused and mistreated as children. Since I'm working with male survivors of sexual abuse as well in another agency other than my own, I know both sides of the story.

What we are dealing with are the layers of stigma, layers of denial, layers of blame, layers of guilt and shame—and collective shame. In understanding why many of those women who are coming here and being abused are not reporting it, and why they are not asking to leave the situation very quickly, it is not only because of the fear of the police and authorities here, not only because of the fear of the CIC, deportation and so on, there is also the fear of what people would say about them back home.

The fact is that many of these women are being forced to stay in marriages because the families back home are asking them to. They are advising them to stay or wait a little bit more until their children are grown up, until this has been done, until they have found jobs, until they find some friends. These are the situations I am working on with women day by day. These women are very traumatized.

It is important to even understanding those men. In our agency every year I do a survey to understand what is the level of violence and domestic abuse that is going on, because no one talks about it.

In our parenting program, many newcomers arrive, people who have arrived one, two, or three weeks ago. They have learned about our programs through the Internet, social media, radio programs that they are listening to daily, and so on, or just by word of mouth. They attend our program. The name of the program is parenting; however, we are talking about many other things. Once they arrive, they are able to ease off and talk about the level of hardship they have gone through. The women are able to hear us—

4:40 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

Madam Poregbal, I'm sorry, I will ask you to conclude. You have a few seconds left.

4:40 p.m.

Founder, Executive Director and Therapist, Greater Vancouver Counselling and Education Society for Families

Poran Poregbal

I just want to make sure I talk about the survey we have done ourselves. On the 500 or 600 surveys that we asked people to fill in, 67 written surveys came back, without names, of course. Everyone is saying, “Yes, there is abuse going on. There is violence going on in our communities and we need to work on it.”

4:40 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

Thank you very much for your opening remarks.

Madam Fakhri, you now have eight minutes.

April 9th, 2014 / 4:40 p.m.

Laila Fakhri Crisis Intervention Counsellor, Herizon House Women's Shelter

Thank you very much. I'm so pleased to be here.

This is a great honour for me to bring forth actual voices and the stories of women whom I have worked with. I listen to women in my role as a counsellor. I came to keenly understand many of the issues and challenges associated with immigrant women who are experiencing domestic violence in Canada.

I want to personally say thank you to Honourable Mr. Chris Alexander, the Immigration Minister, and those who are involved in the study committee for having us here.

I would like to begin with the intention and hope that the Harvard principle of lessons learned will keep another person from meeting the fate that was met by the four females from the Shafia family in 2009 in Kingston, Ontario, and Ms. Nasira Fazli in 2013 in Ajax, Ontario, as well as many other women who are and continue to become victims of domestic violence.

I have learned that the issue of domestic violence associated with immigrant women has many causes, some of which are either unrecognized or simply unknown. I wish to highlight the following major factors that predispose immigrant women to domestic violence.

First, women are involved in an arranged marriage as a result of forced unions.

Second, women are uninformed about their rights and cultural norms in Canada.

Third, women are financially dependent on their abuser—or their spouse, I would say.

I should emphasize that the first point is deemed to be the most complicated and perhaps has the greatest impact on increasing the risk of domestic violence against immigrant women. In particular women typically raised in Canada are often encouraged by their own family members to enter into an arranged marriage. Women who share their stories recount tales of agreeing to this sort of union in order to satisfy their parents' wishes.

The perception is that this cultural practice preserves the cultural and ancestral lineage amidst a diaspora and war. This kind of marriage is also accepted by the family and the community because it is thought that the sponsor is making an altruistic decision to give an opportunity for a better life to the relative. Unfortunately these arranged marriages often quickly turn to forced marriages because women are oblivious to the exact nature of the union. Although a variety of scenarios exists, I would like to address one notable example where the woman is sponsoring the husband.

In situations where the woman has sponsored her partner from back home, after the arranged marriage he arrives in Canada to find her as an established and financially independent woman fully integrated into Canadian society. The husband may undergo cultural shock because he's not familiar with the differences in cultural values between his new bride and his own expectation. He may present well on the surface, but his mentality is heavily influenced by his own patriarchal cultural beliefs.

A few questions come to mind. Has he been culturally educated, prepared, and assimilated? Is he ready to adapt to a Canadian lifestyle? Is he ready to accept the shift switch for his wife to drive, to work, to be fully independent, and to do things without asking for his permission?

I propose the following recommendations to help address some of the above noted challenges.

First, an information booklet on fundamental rights and freedoms, in particular women's rights, should be distributed to applicants of the sponsorship program as a mandatory requirement for review prior to approval for entry into Canada. The interview process may be used as an appropriate step in the sponsorship program to test knowledge on the content of the information booklet, which should be offered in a variety of languages. I would like to personally offer guidance in developing the booklet.

Second, immigrant women who lack sufficiency may be dangerously dependent on their husbands for financial support. The repercussions for the woman of this type of financial dependency may include reduced self-confidence, increased isolation, and psychological, mental, and social health problems.

Concerning the financial issue I mentioned, I believe that when a woman is sponsored by her husband and is coming to Canada, she should receive some source of financial help on a monthly basis in her own account, whether the money is coming from the person who has sponsored her or from government, because from my experience, what I notice among women I work with is that a woman may stay in Canada for more than two and three years and not know how to use public transit, and she may never have had a bank account in her own name. That adds to her isolation. It adds to her need to ask the husband every day for $5 to go to do something.

If a woman receives this money, or if it becomes mandatory for the person who has sponsored to deposit the money to a trust or to a Canadian account for the duration of two years, at least a minimum amount equal to the money that social services pays to an individual for her basic needs and the money automatically goes to the woman's account, that assists a woman to have at least some independence.

The third recommendation is that language classes after the woman arrives in Canada should be compulsory, so that a woman cannot be prevented by her family or the husband from attending classes.

Fourth, after she arrives in Canada, we need to assist her in integrating and connect her with settlement workers.

Some of these provisions are already in place; however, more work needs to be done. Ideally, appointments with settlement workers should be arranged without the presence of the husband, and the meetings would be enhanced if the worker were a woman. I believe it should be mandatory, for the duration of two years, for the woman to have regular contact with a settlement agency.

If we Canadians believe that Canada is the world leader in promotion and protection of women and women's rights and of gender equality, what do we need to do to bring this talk to a walk?

We should provide opportunities for immigrant women by creating a system to protect women's rights and gender equality. In order to create the system, we need to fill in the gaps that exist, because these gaps create barriers for women to practise their basic human rights. By empowering a woman we give her the opportunity to fully access personal power, authority, and influence, and to use this strength when dealing with family members who are pressuring her.

4:50 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

I will ask you to conclude, please, Madam Fakhri.

4:50 p.m.

Crisis Intervention Counsellor, Herizon House Women's Shelter

Laila Fakhri

Thank you. I would like to express much gratitude to all of you for your time and for being here with us. I believe in hope. I believe in change. Together we can do our part to change policies so as to curb violence against women.

Thank you.

4:50 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

Thank you very much, Madam Fakhri.

Now Madam Niazi, you have the floor for eight minutes.

4:50 p.m.

Adeena Niazi Executive Director, Afghan Women's Organization

Thank you.

Madam Chair, honourable members, thank you for the opportunity to be here today.

My summation will be focused on the issues of spousal sponsorship and spousal reunification and on violence against women and girls. My presentation is based on more than 24 years of experience working with clients, predominantly refugees and newcomers who have experienced war and violence, mainly from Afghanistan, central Asia, and the Middle East.

I would like to begin by saying that it is very important for us to strengthen the immigration system for both immigrants and refugees, because I believe that Canada has been a leader globally in the resettling of refugees and in its compassion for refugees.

One of the key concerns around the spousal sponsorship program is the long processing time. The 32-month wait often affects the relationship. The sponsored spouse and his or her family often gets the impression that there is no sincerity in the marriage. Some officers who have limited understanding of the cultural context and the realities of the life of the sponsored spouses have refused genuine spouses in their first interview. The rejection creates additional hardship, along with a heavy financial burden on the sponsor, who has to appeal the decision.

We recommend that the visa officers should receive comprehensive training on the living conditions and cultural realities of the sponsored spouses.

For the refugee women who make an inland claim, leaving their children and spouses behind, the normal wait period to reunite with their families ranges between four and six years. This long separation sometimes results in the breakdown of the family. Many women develop depression and anxiety as a result of the separation from their family. This in turn has an impact on women's health, their settlement process, and their ability to contribute to society.

We recommend that upon the acceptance of the convention refugee status of the refugee claimant, her or his family reunification should be expedited.

There are also a number of issues that impact sponsored spouses during their post-arrival period in Canada.

I think the temporary residency condition has been mentioned before, and I agree with Ms. Long regarding it. I just want to say that although there is an exemption for cases in which abuse is involved, some of the women may not know about their rights if they don't have access to services, and they need more information. They are not aware of their rights, so this information has to be available.

Besides this, there have also been some cases in which women have sponsored their partners to come over to Canada, and then the men have left them and have abused them. Sometimes they have applied for social assistance, but the abused sponsoring spouse is then left having to continue to pay for the sponsored spouse under the sponsorship agreement. This also needs to be rectified. If a sponsored spouse chooses to leave when abuse is not the case, then he or she should be financially responsible for herself or himself.

We recommend that CIC discuss domestic violence and women's rights at the orientation, which is usually held at the visa office, or at least prior to their arrival to Canada. They need to have the information before they arrive in Canada. There also needs to be more outreach and support programs for newcomer women at the ground level.

Recent cuts in the funding for settlement services have created backlogs and huge caseloads, making it difficult to keep track of vulnerable women. It is important also for the CIC to take into consideration the special needs of women, separate from those of men. Additionally, they need to take into account the great diversity among women and how it affects their needs for different services.

At the Afghan Women's Organization we have noted some recurring issues within the sponsorship program that support the need for an approach that takes into account the complexity of socio-cultural practices and the inherent challenges of cross-border relationships.

For example, in most of the Muslim countries, and it was mentioned that this also happens in Israel, proxy marriages are a culturally and legally acceptable means for a couple to unite. These practices are most common in countries affected by war. These marriages are legal, binding, and it's with the consent of both parties. We have witnessed many successful proxy-arranged marriages in which the sponsor has provided unconditional support.

I also want to mention that whether or not sponsors have certain skills and attributes like education, language, and social status should not be taken into consideration as a factor in preventing abuse cases. A person can be abused or abusive regardless of his or her education, social status, religion, ethnicity, or language ability. This is more common in cases of isolated women, who have a limited understanding of their rights and are unable to access the services available to them. Canada should maintain family values in the spouse reunification for all couples, equally and equitably.

Newcomer refugee women can be empowered through the provision of information and through targeted programs for specific groups of women, for example, women-only language classes where they cover issues such as family violence, spouse abuse, women's rights, legal rights and responsibilities, and also offer referrals to other community programs. There are lots of stories, but I think my time would be over—

5 p.m.

NDP

The Vice-Chair NDP Lysane Blanchette-Lamothe

You have one more minute.

5 p.m.

Executive Director, Afghan Women's Organization

Adeena Niazi

I just want to conclude by saying that while the economy is definitely important to our country, there has to be a balance between financial interest and ensuring that human rights and dignity are accessible to all.

Thank you.