Evidence of meeting #33 for Citizenship and Immigration in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was province.
A recording is available from Parliament.
3:30 p.m.
The Clerk of the Committee Mr. Mike MacPherson
Good afternoon, honourable members. It's been brought to our attention that neither the chair nor the vice-chairs are present today.
I'm prepared to receive nominations for an acting chair.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
I would like to move that Mr. Devinder Shory be in the chair.
3:30 p.m.
The Clerk
Is it agreed?
3:30 p.m.
Some hon. members
Agreed.
3:30 p.m.
The Clerk
Come and take the chair, Mr. Shory.
We will suspend the meeting.
3:35 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Devinder Shory
Welcome to the witnesses. Thank you for waiting outside for a couple of minutes. We had to deal with some committee business, which was dealt with quickly and cooperatively.
Each witness will have up to 10 minutes to make their presentation and then members will have their chance to ask questions.
Mr. de Vlieger.
November 17th, 2014 / 3:35 p.m.
Matt de Vlieger Acting Director General, International and Intergovernmental Relations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair, and honourable members of Parliament.
My name is Matt de Vlieger. I'm the acting director general of international and intergovernmental relations at Citizenship and Immigration Canada.
I'm accompanied by Mr. Daniel MacDonald. He's the chief of Canada health transfer/Canada social transfer and northern policy at Finance Canada.
We are here today to answer any technical questions you may have related to the changes to the Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements Act, under part 4, division 5 of Bill C-43.
Overall, the proposed amendments to the Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements Act, or FPFAA, as we'll probably be referring to it today, seek to provide provinces and territories with greater flexibility to introduce minimum periods of residence before most foreign nationals can access social assistance in their jurisdictions.
Provincial and territorial governments have constitutional jurisdiction over social assistance and the proposed amendments fully respect this jurisdiction. lt is therefore up to each province and territory to determine the eligibility for social assistance benefits. This also means that, should they choose to introduce a residency requirement for foreign nationals, provinces and territories would determine the length of the residency period.
Currently, provinces and territories cannot impose a minimum period of residence on the receipt of social assistance without a reduction in their Canada social transfer payments. The proposed measures would provide provinces and territories with greater flexibility by removing this impediment with respect to foreign nationals.
Just to be clear, these changes do not apply to Canadian citizens; permanent residents; protected persons, and by that we mean protected persons as refugees; and victims of human trafficking who hold valid temporary resident permits.
Under the proposed changes, should provinces and territories choose to introduce a residency requirement, most foreign nationals could be subject to a minimum period of residence. This would include temporary foreign workers, international students, visitors, and asylum claimants.
It is important to note that, under the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act, to obtain a visitor visa, or a study or work permit, all foreign nationals must demonstrate that they can support themselves and their dependants financially for the duration of their stay. The proposed amendments align with that requirement.
In effect, these measures would provide the provinces and territories with some additional flexibility to establish minimum periods of residence for foreign nationals to qualify for social assistance, which is in their jurisdiction. If they do so, it would mean that they wouldn't have a reduction in their Canada social transfer payments. They provide provinces and territories with additional tools to shape their social assistance benefit regimes should they choose to take advantage of them.
I look forward to your questions, but I'd like to first turn the floor over to Daniel MacDonald, from the Department of Finance, to add a little bit more context on the Canada social transfer.
3:40 p.m.
Daniel MacDonald Chief, Canada Health Transfer (CHT)/Canada Social Transfer (CST) and Northern Policy , Department of Finance
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair, and honourable members of Parliament.
My name is Daniel MacDonald. I am the chief of Canada health transfer/Canada social transfer and northern policy group in the federal-provincial relations division at the Department of Finance.
I am here today to answer any technical questions you may have related to the changes to the Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements Act, under part 4, division 5 of Bill C-43 as they relate to the operation of the Canada social transfer itself.
The Canada Social Transfer (CST) is a federal block transfer to all provinces and territories in support of three broad areas of social policy. The first is post-secondary education, the second is programs for children, and the third is social assistance and other social programs.
In 2014-15 the total CST transferred to all provinces and territories is almost $12.6 billion. It has grown at 3% annually since 2008-09 and will continue to grow at 3% annually at least until 2024 when the next review of the CST legislation will take place.
These funds are allocated to provinces on an equal per capita basis so that each province receives its population's share of the total amount of the transfer. With respect to accountability, provincial and territorial governments are fully responsible for the design and delivery of programs in the areas supported by the CST, and are accountable to the residents and legislatures, not the federal government, for outcomes achieved and dollars spent.
Starting in 2007-08, the federal government enhanced the transparency of its support by notionally allocating the total transfer across each of the three priority areas: post-secondary education, social programs, and children's programs. These notional allocations are not binding, explicitly recognizing provincial and territorial government flexibility to invest in these areas according to their own priorities.
With respect to conditionality, the Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements Act currently states that, in order to receive their full CST funding, provinces or territories must not impose minimum residency requirements for social assistance.
If a province violates the minimum residency prohibition stated in the FPFAA for the CST, the act requires the Minister of Employment and Social Development to engage the province in the withholding process described in statute. If the minister concludes that the province is not in compliance, the minister must then refer the matter to the Governor in Council who may direct that the province's CST amount be reduced by whatever amount it considers appropriate.
Should this proposal pass as part of Bill C-43, provinces will able to impose a minimum residency requirement on certain foreign nationals, as described by my colleague earlier, without triggering the statutory withholding process for the CST.
No other elements of the CST will be affected. In particular, the total transfer amount and the provincial and territorial equal per capita cash allocations will be unaffected if the provinces and territories impose minimum residency requirements consistent with the current proposal. There is no link between the legislated CST amount and allocation and the actual social assistance expenditures of a province or territory.
Thank you, and we look forward to any questions you may have.
But first, I will pass to my colleague Caitlin Imrie.
3:45 p.m.
Caitlin Imrie Director General, Passport Operational Coordination, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Good afternoon, Mr. Chair and honourable members of Parliament.
My name is Caitlin Imrie, I'm the director general of passport operational coordination at Citizenship and Immigration Canada.
I am here today to answer any technical questions you may have related to the change to the Revolving Funds Act, under part 4, division 7 of Bill C-43.
This is a technical amendment to update the relevant provisions of the Revolving Funds Act to reflect the transfer of responsibility for the passport program from the Minister of Foreign Affairs to the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration, which took effect on July 2, 2013.
This amendment changes the title preceding section 4, while subsections 4(1) and 4(2) have already been changed.
Thank you, and I look forward to any questions you may have.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Acting Chair Conservative Devinder Shory
I guess I have to thank the witnesses for doing half of my job, to pass that on to the next presenter.
We'll start with Mr. Menegakis.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I want to thank our officials for being here with us today and for your presentation to us.
Mr. de Vlieger, this appears to be more of an administrative change. However, having said that, could you tell me if this has been requested by the provinces and territories?
3:45 p.m.
Acting Director General, International and Intergovernmental Relations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Sure, and I've certainly seen some of the commentary in the media and some of the questions that members of this committee and other members of Parliament have had about this. No, this wasn't specifically requested by the provinces. This is a facilitative amendment, as we've described.
The amendment would remove the potential of a penalty under the Canada social transfer if a province or territory chose to implement a minimum residency requirement on certain foreign nationals. The ambit is rather narrow so in that sense you're right that it's an administrative arrangement. The act is an administrative arrangement around how the Canada social transfer operates.
In terms of the background with our discussions with provinces, we've certainly had some conversations with provinces about this amendment. In fact, over the course of time when we were doing some policy work on the refugee reforms that were introduced in 2012, and looking at some of the factors that the government was concerned about around unfounded asylum claims, there were conversations with provinces about the kinds of factors that might make some of these unfounded claims attractive for claimants to make. It was in the course of those conversations that we did have a representation from one of the provinces that there was a provision in one of the federal acts—this act that we're talking about today—that would in fact limit their ability to impose such a residency requirement.
That is some of the context of the background for the government looking at this particular piece of legislation.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
Thank you.
Before I ask my next question, let me just officially, one more time since it's the first time we've met as a committee, welcome our new clerk to the team. Welcome, sir. I'm sure all of us, on all sides of the House, look forward to working with you.
You mentioned in your presentation giving the provinces and territories greater flexibility to introduce a minimum period of time of residence, in effect empowering them to make their own decisions. Can you elaborate on that a little bit, please?
3:45 p.m.
Acting Director General, International and Intergovernmental Relations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
As honourable members would be aware, under the Constitution social service benefits fall within the purview of provincial governments so they are the ones responsible for setting rates and eligibility requirements with respect to social assistance benefits.
The only condition that was applied in respect of the Canada social transfer was a condition of not having a minimum residency requirement, so that is the condition that the bill proposes to adjust.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
Does the federal government today have any say in who receives social assistance, other than the restrictions of a minimum period of residence in the FPFAA?
3:50 p.m.
Acting Director General, International and Intergovernmental Relations, Department of Citizenship and Immigration
Other than the condition of minimum residency, no. The provinces and territories set rates and eligibility criteria, and they can vary from province to province.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
Perhaps Mr. MacDonald can answer my next question.
How much money does each province get, and how is the funding allocated to each province?
3:50 p.m.
Chief, Canada Health Transfer (CHT)/Canada Social Transfer (CST) and Northern Policy , Department of Finance
For the fiscal year 2014-15, this year, you're talking about $12.582 billion. In terms of allocation across the provinces and territories, you have $187 million to Newfoundland, $52 million to Prince Edward Island, $334 million to Nova Scotia, $267 million to New Brunswick, $2.9 billion to Quebec, $4.8 billion to Ontario, $454 million to Manitoba, $398 million to Saskatchewan, $1.457 billion to Alberta, $1.6 billion to British Columbia, $13 million to Yukon, $13 million to Nunavut, and $15 million to Northwest Territories.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
Thank you.
Perhaps you wouldn't mind providing that information through the clerk to the members here. We would appreciate that, sir.
Other than for social assistance, what else would this money be used for? Would the amendments to the Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements Act impact only social assistance or other aspects covered under the Canada social transfer?
3:50 p.m.
Chief, Canada Health Transfer (CHT)/Canada Social Transfer (CST) and Northern Policy , Department of Finance
The Canada social transfer is a bloc transferred to provinces and territories. Nationally it is allocated across three areas, which I described in my remarks: support for children, post-secondary education, and social assistance and other social programs.
In terms of the breakdown, the notional allocation in 2014-15 for support for children was $1.3 billion or about 10.4% of the total; for post-secondary education in 2014-15 the total notional allocation was $3.86 billion or 30.7% of the total transfer; and social assistance and other social programs was a total of $7.4 billion or 59% of the total transfer.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
How many times a year is this money transferred? Is it a one-time payment, or is it like a monthly transfer? How often does it happen?
3:50 p.m.
Chief, Canada Health Transfer (CHT)/Canada Social Transfer (CST) and Northern Policy , Department of Finance
It's paid out in equal installments twice each month.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
So twice each month the provinces and territories receive this money.
3:50 p.m.
Chief, Canada Health Transfer (CHT)/Canada Social Transfer (CST) and Northern Policy , Department of Finance
They receive one twenty-fourth of their total.
3:50 p.m.
Conservative
Costas Menegakis Conservative Richmond Hill, ON
That's wonderful. Thank you very much. It has been very helpful.
That's my time, I believe.