Citizenship and Immigration Committee on May 3rd, 2018

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

—given that that's the key talking point that the government's using for their response?

[Mike MacDonald]

Our department will, indeed.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Mr. Cloutier, with regard to the surge capacity workforce that you mentioned in your minutes, can you please table with the committee all documents related to the establishment of the workforce, including any plans to reallocate staff from other lines of service, as well as the scope of the workforce plan?

[Jacques Cloutier]

We will, indeed, to the extent that we're not compromising operational [Inaudible-Editor].

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm afraid I need to end there.

Ms. Kwan, for seven minutes.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I would like to thank all the officials as well—in particular those who are actually on the front lines, if you will, doing an excellent job. I want to express my appreciation to them for that through you.

First I would like to ask you, Mr. MacDonald, whether you can confirm that officials at your department have asked the U.S. Department of Homeland Security officials to amend the safe third country agreement to apply it to the entire Canadian border in an unofficial capacity.

[Mike MacDonald]

Mr. Chair, again, we have not asked the United States to amend. It's a treaty. What we've done is express to them our concerns with the outdated treaty. We have demonstrated to them our list, which I described, of challenges. This is a start of a conversation, should they wish to pick up that conversation.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Okay, then let me say this.

I understand that in an unofficial capacity you're not talking about amending, but have you expressed an interest for Canada to see that mechanism or approach taken: to apply the safe third country agreement to the entire border?

[Mike MacDonald]

I'm trying to be helpful, Mr. Chair. Again, we have had conversations with the Americans at the working level; we've expressed our concerns and our challenges. We have not gone into what an end state could be, should we ever go into a formal negotiation. It would not be prudent to try to dictate where a negotiation might go, should there ever be one.

The answer, then, is no, we have not tried to foreshadow or predict the future.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Your request to the United States that Canada be able to turn back asylum seekers who come through unofficial border entries has been made; is that not correct? You have explored the idea of how Canada can turn back asylum seekers who enter into Canada through unofficial ports of entry.

[Mike MacDonald]

Again, Chair, we have expressed our concerns and shared our concerns around the challenges of the way the current agreement is operating in today's context.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you. I will, then, wait for the Tabletalk documents to see what those concerns are and how they are being expressed, because clearly I'm not going to get an answer on this.

All right, I would like to then ask this question.

Article 10 of the safe third country agreement, paragraph 3 reads:

Either Party may, upon written notice to the other Party, suspend for a period of up to three months application of this Agreement.

For the temporary suspension we can just give notice; is that correct?

[Mike MacDonald]

That's correct. That is how the article reads.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Has that been expressed by the government to the U.S. officials?

[Mike MacDonald]

We have not expressed a desire to invoke article 10.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

No.

In the discussion you've had with the U.S. officials about the safe third country agreement, then, what other items might you have brought up? Can you table that information with the committee?

[Mike MacDonald]

Chair, I believe that's the same question the other honourable member had. I described the two or three main concerns that we have. That is what we have shared with the Americans.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Okay.

My next question is to the RCMP representatives.

You mentioned that while the vast majority of the irregular crossings are coming through Quebec, they are happening in Manitoba and B.C. as well, as we know.

Can you give us the numbers of the interceptions that have taken place in B.C. and in Manitoba, please?

[D/Commr Gilles Michaud]

Yes.

Is that for this year or last year?

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

It's for both years.

[D/Commr Gilles Michaud]

I have the number for last year, which in Manitoba was 1,018 and in British Columbia was 718. Unfortunately, I don't have the numbers with me for this year.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

If you could table them with the committee, it would be appreciated.

My question, then, is to the representatives from CBSA. You were cut off on the idea.... If, for example, the idea were to apply the safe third country agreement to the entire border of Canada, how feasible would that be? Can it be enforced? If it can be enforced, what kinds of resources would you actually need?

[Jacques Cloutier]

We're talking, are we, about declaring the entire border a port?

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

That's correct.