Citizenship and Immigration Committee on March 18th, 2019

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you.

There were two stories, Ms. Morgan. One was published by Global News, and the writer was Amanda Connolly, and the other one was by CTV, Teresa Wright. I think they're both referring to the same memo.

I'm just wondering if you could clarify for us the date of the memo that I mentioned earlier, the access to information request, where it was suggested by your department that the safe third country agreement was no longer working as intended, the quote that I read earlier. The Canadian Press story cites that it was written in January 2017, and the Global News story said it was written in January 2018. Which year is correct?

[Marta Morgan]

I don't have the memo. Do you have it?

[Paul MacKinnon, Assistant Deputy Minister, Strategic and Program Policy, Department of Citizenship and Immigration]

I'll check further, but I believe it was 2018, because that was in reference to the meeting that the minister was having.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Right, so 2018. Great, thank you. That is very helpful.

I just want to ask a couple of other questions outside of that.

There was a story that was in the news a few weeks ago, on February 20, that an individual named Harjit Singh was able to gain entry into Canada, and he, of course, was deported from Canada 13 years ago because of serious criminal allegations, including human smuggling. He was able to enter Canada again recently due partly to a letter of support from MP Raj Grewal. I understand that your department has promised MP Judy Sgro that you would investigate this and report back to her why this could have happened. Do you have the results of that investigation?

[Marta Morgan]

I do not have the results of that investigation at this time.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I remind the member to try to at least loosely tie it to the estimates. Thank you.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Certainly, the department spends a lot of resources responding to requests from MPs, so there you are.

Do you anticipate when that investigation will be done?

[Marta Morgan]

Mr. Chair, I would have to provide the member, the committee, with information on this in writing, because at this time I don't have the details that are being requested.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you for committing to do that.

I also notice that IRCC is on the lobbyist registry for SNC-Lavalin. It says they want changes to travel visas. What are these changes, and have you implemented them?

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm afraid I won't be able to have you answer; that's your time.

Mr. Sarai.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

I'm going to carry on from Mr. Rankin and Mr. Whelan. I have a lot of constituents in my riding who applied for the parents and grandparents program, and I'm well aware that in 2012 the parents and grandparents program by the previous Conservative government was closed down.

It wasn't until, I think, 2015 that it was opened only for about 5,000 applications. Subsequently, we doubled that to 10,000, and then last year, I think there were 17,000. I also understand 170,000 were left as a backlog.

I want to first of all thank you for eliminating most of that backlog and bringing in the timelines. I think it was even longer than 72 months, because I have constituents who applied prior to 2012 who are getting their parents and grandparents in now. It's my estimate that it's probably six years plus, so maybe 72 to 84 months.

However, many of my constituents, as you've cited and heard from others, missed the opportunity this year again. We've tried the lottery. We've tried the courier system. Have there been any discussions in opening up the parents and grandparents program to a first-in, first-out line or queue, just like virtually everything else we have, whether it's for spouses or others? You stay in line and, as you are processed, you come in. I think we have programs whereby we have the opportunity to bring in parents or grandparents in the interim, either by a temporary resident visa or by the specific super visa for parents and grandparents. Has this been discussed? Up until, I think, 2012 that was the way for decades.

[Marta Morgan]

Mr. Chair, I think that the challenge with the parent and grandparent program is, as Dr. Kochhar noted, its great popularity. Every year, there are many more people who would like to sponsor their parents or grandparents to come to Canada than we have space for in the levels plan.

There have been different approaches taken to this. Prior to 2012, when there was no limit on the annual intake, the result was the creation of very large backlogs that took many years to resolve and had people waiting for a long time.

Other ways that we have tried to deal with the difference between the number of people who would like to sponsor and the number of spaces we have in the annual levels plan have been, as the honourable member noted, queuing with careers, first-come, first-served—which we did this year—and the lottery that we did last year.

There are a number of ways to manage this issue. However, I think that the primary challenge here is really the difference between the number of individuals and families who would like to sponsor their parents and grandparents, and the amount of space. It has increased significantly over the last number of years, from 5,000 to 20,000, and is increasing over the next few years. Nonetheless, there is not enough space in the levels plan to meet all of the demand for the program.

[Randeep Sarai, Liberal, Surrey Centre, BC]

With due respect, I would argue that this was more the case when the line was long but the intake was small, which built up a large backlog. At the rate you're going, it has actually been very fine. Even when you speak to those who have been waiting for up to 72 months, they're not disappointed with that system. They're actually patient with it. They get to bring their parents in the interim, either through a super visa or through a TRV, but at least they know they're in line.

The current system—and I will say this with almost 100% feedback from my constituents—is not something that they like, because every year they're uncertain. Year after year, they're in line, they have one out of five chances like last year and probably this year, or they don't even know because it got shut off.

They would rather have the certainty of knowing they're in a queue—they know it'll be maybe two years, five years or six years, but they have other avenues to come in the interim—rather than renewing a chance where, if they're unlucky, every year they'll never make the number. If they have everything done and have done their documents, then waiting is much better.

I think the previous system didn't work because the number of actual spots was being reduced, and those spots weren't being filled, which built a backlog of 167,000. If you had 100,000 now, that would really be because of the pent-up demand. I think it would be appropriate to take that, and I think it's my duty as the member of Parliament for Surrey Centre to relay that information to you. I think it would be almost unanimous, regardless of the partisanship—

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm afraid I need to end you there. I'm not sure there was a question in there anyway.

Mr. Tilson, you have five minutes.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

Can you tell us what the current backlog is at the IRB for illegal border crossers?

[Paul MacKinnon]

The total backlog is just about 80,000. I would have to look and see. You asked specifically about the irregular portion of that. We can look at that, but the total is 80,000.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

How many border crossers are still living in hotels?

[Paul MacKinnon]

Zero.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

What's been the cost to date, since the beginning of 2017, of housing illegal border crossers?

[Marta Morgan]

I would note that in the supplementary estimates (B) there is $14.7 million related to temporary housing, but the vast majority of that at this point is used at the border when irregular border crossers come across. There was less than $2 million of that used for the summer, to assist the City of Toronto in managing the overflow in their shelter system. About $2 million was spent out of the supplementary estimates we see today.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

What's the current wait time for a hearing before the IRB for the illegal border crossers?

[Nick Whalen, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'm just going to say that the IRB is an independent agency. It's not in the supplementary estimates (B) as I understand it.

[David Tilson, Conservative, Dufferin—Caledon, ON]

What's the current rate of rejection of asylum claims of illegal border crossers?

[Nick Whalen, Liberal, St. John's East, NL]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.